Author Topic: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase  (Read 1362 times)

Offline Josh

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3187
    • -
    • East Central Region
I was going to keep this quiet and drop it at Nationals, but I think the full combo is too difficult to pull off (it waters down your Teams decks too much).  I think a half-combo is a better goal, as you can incorporate it into a strong Teams deck of Judges/Throne/Philistines without watering it down.

Full combo setup:

A Gold NT hero in my territory
A Philistine EC in my territory and my teammate's territory
Ashkelon played as a site in my territory
An OT LS or the NT Hand Discard LS in LoB
Site Doubler LS in LoB
The Prodigal Returns in my hand

Yeah, that's a lot of setup, but there's a lot of tutoring we can do to get there.  I won't muck up this post with a listing of all of the ways.  Suffice to say, the NT Gold hero in territory and having The Prodigal Returns in hand are the most taxing part of the combo (primarily because NT Gold is bad in Teams).

Combo:

1. Add OT LS or Hand Discard LS to Ashkelon.  (Each opponent discards 2 cards in hand, as this puts Ashkelon in the common LoB and triggers for both of us)
2. Add the Site Doubler to Ashkelon.  (2 more from hand from each opponent)
3. Play The Prodigal Returns, take the LS out of Ashkelon.
4. See Step 1.


The Half-Combo basically removes the NT Gold Hero and The Prodigal Returns and lets you play a solid Judges/Throne/Philistines deck.  The "combo" then becomes potentially discarding 4 cards from each opponents' hand instead of 8.  (Note that Avenged, which is a solid GE for Judges, actually tutors Ashkelon when played as a Black EE!) 

And if this isn't going to work out at the beginning of the game, play Ashkelon as a Fort instead, since it will basically be drawing you and your teammate 3 cards each Upkeep!

*****

Ironically, this combo was waaaaay easier to pull off before the recent Teams deckbuilding rule change about LS, since you could have 2 Hand Discard LS and 2 Site Doublers   ;)
If creation sings Your praises so will I
If You gave Your life to love them so will I

Offline The Guardian

  • Playtester, Redemption Elder
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12340
  • The Stars are coming out...
    • -
    • North Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #1 on: April 24, 2019, 03:01:22 PM »
+2
Spoiler (hover to show)

Then you realize your opponents are using Zebulun... ::)
Fortress Alstad
Have you checked the REG?
Have you looked it up in ORCID?

Offline Josh

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3187
    • -
    • East Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #2 on: April 25, 2019, 10:19:45 AM »
0
There are ways to stop this for sure, like R&D, Shipwreck, 3 Woes, Crowds LS, etc.  Those 3 Doms will probably be in my opponent's decks, so that's another reason going "Full Combo" is a bad idea in my head.

But, if I can bait a 3 Woes on Ashkelon and it doesn't get used as an in-battle Negate, I can live with that.  Same with Shipwreck going after Ashkelon - that means SW isn't hitting our Sheols or Babels.

Also, who plays Genesis in Teams...?   ;)
If creation sings Your praises so will I
If You gave Your life to love them so will I

Offline The Guardian

  • Playtester, Redemption Elder
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12340
  • The Stars are coming out...
    • -
    • North Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #3 on: April 25, 2019, 10:28:54 AM »
+2

Also, who plays Genesis in Teams...?   ;)

I've seen it done and done it myself.  8)
Fortress Alstad
Have you checked the REG?
Have you looked it up in ORCID?

Offline Josh

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3187
    • -
    • East Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #4 on: April 25, 2019, 10:41:19 AM »
0

Also, who plays Genesis in Teams...?   ;)

I've seen it done and done it myself.  8)

I knew there was a reason I liked to put Outsiders (Crimson/Brown) and Gideon's Ephod in my Reserve as a Deceiver target   ;)
If creation sings Your praises so will I
If You gave Your life to love them so will I

Offline thecoolguy

  • Full Member
  • ***
  • Posts: 416
  • Pagan sailors is the best
    • -
    • East Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #5 on: April 25, 2019, 11:09:23 AM »
0
Zebulun is the best 😜😜😜😜
If I speak with human eloquence and angelic ecstasy but don't love I am nothing.

Offline jbeers285

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 3369
  • bravo
    • -
    • Northeast Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #6 on: April 25, 2019, 01:06:32 PM »
0

Also, who plays Genesis in Teams...?   ;)

I've seen it done and done it myself.  8)

I knew there was a reason I liked to put Outsiders (Crimson/Brown) and Gideon's Ephod in my Reserve as a Deceiver target   ;)

Except Joe makes zeb CBN and protected from discard so a 0/0 doesn’t go anywhere.
JMM is a modern day prophet

Offline Kor

  • Sr. Member
  • ****
  • Posts: 756
    • -
    • North Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #7 on: April 25, 2019, 01:32:43 PM »
0

Also, who plays Genesis in Teams...?   ;)

I've seen it done and done it myself.  8)

I knew there was a reason I liked to put Outsiders (Crimson/Brown) and Gideon's Ephod in my Reserve as a Deceiver target   ;)

Except Joe makes zeb CBN and protected from discard so a 0/0 doesn’t go anywhere.

That used to be true but I believe protection from discard no longer protects from decrease or numerical discarding.
Life is what you make of it.

Offline The Guardian

  • Playtester, Redemption Elder
  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 12340
  • The Stars are coming out...
    • -
    • North Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #8 on: April 25, 2019, 01:33:53 PM »
0
Kor is correct.

"Protect from discard" has been defined to mean "protection from discard abilities" and does not include protection from game rules for discard.
Fortress Alstad
Have you checked the REG?
Have you looked it up in ORCID?

Offline Gabe

  • Global Moderator
  • *****
  • Posts: 10655
  • From Moses to the prophets, it's all about Him!
    • -
    • North Central Region
    • Land of Redemption
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #9 on: April 25, 2019, 01:34:20 PM »
0
The relevant REG quote

Quote from: REG>Protection>Clarifications
For all other effects, “protect X from Y (abilities)” means “protect X from Y effects of abilities”.
Have you visited the Land of Redemption today?

Offline Ironisaac

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 1662
  • 2070 Paradigm Shift Inbound
    • -
    • North Central Region
Re: TEAMS combo: Discard your opponents' hands during Intro Prep Phase
« Reply #10 on: April 25, 2019, 10:55:10 PM »
0
Well, if you are running CoW joseph to protect zeb, you should be running Goshen anyways.  ;)
Some call me "Goofus"