Cactus Game Design Message Boards

All of them

One of each there are 7 brigades with ems

One of each there are 7 brigades with ems

What if I choose to target Serpent for pale green and sword as crimson? I can't choose astrologers in that scenario.

Two Bears doesn't shuffle per brigade, it shuffles one of each brigade present. Kevin's example is correct.

So what about all targets are selected when it's played? If the number of brigades is 7, how are you not picking one of each?

Okay sure so what are you selecting for gold, black, and all of the other ones?

Kind of trying to understand by that logic why you couldn't just do ems since it has all of them..

Right but if you get to pick whatever you want since the condition doesn't have to be met for 7 why not just do 1 of all? Ems

with Kevin, Daniel, John and Gabe. 

Nope, you select EMS for one of them then the rest based on what you selected for EMS.

Technically you could select one of the others first, but that would be silly cuz EMS is always going to get shuffled unless you have 7 other cards with all the evil brigades.

One card per for each target brigade. That's how Two Bears' ability works.

"One card of each brigade" which ems is one card of each brigade

yeah i changed my argument to the other end of the spectrum for the sake of unveiling the logic here lacking a two way function

i'm not confused on what is being said, i get the intention.

if you can select ems as crimson, serpent as pale green, to can't select astrologers in the end you effectively aren't shuffling a card of each brigade in play.

if you are able to do this, then you are able to select one card in play of each brigade.. which is in fact one card ems, which has each in play

In the example, upon completion, was one card of each evil brigade in play selected? The answer is no.

Two bears checks to see if you met the condition and finds: False - one of each was not selected.

Love yall

I play Two bears on Hosea against Ahab. Ahab is of course shuffled, but I also have Promo The Serpent, Every Man's Sword CoW , and astrologers all in my territory. Which would be shuffled?

No cards are shuffled because King Ahab negates Two Bears...

Two Bears counts cards and shuffles one card of each evil brigade. The controller of Two Bears selects which cards are shuffled. Two Bears can shuffle a maximum of one card of black, brown, orange, pale green, gold, gray, and crimson. Here's the list of cards in that scenario (assuming King Ahab is not negating Two Bears):

Ahab, in battle - Brown
Serpent, territory - Crimson, Pale Green, Orange
Every Man's Sword - Crimson, Pale Green, Orange, Black, Brown, Gold, Gray
Astrologers - Crimson, Pale Green

If these are the only evil cards on the table (somehow EMS is floating without a bearer), then Two Bears can shuffle a maximum of four and a minimum of three. If the opponent controlled all of these cards, you would want to shuffle them all, so you'd select colors that would allow you to target each of them. Ahab as brown, Serpent as orange, Astrologers as crimson, EMS as any remaining brigades. If you didn't want to shuffle Ahab, you'd select EMS as brown.

Since you choose the targets for Two Bears individually, you choose what counts as what. Obviously, you select Ahab to shuffle as a Brown card. You can choose EMS to count as any (except brown in this case), but Two Bears only counts EMS once total. So, assuming you don't want to shuffle all of your cards, you could select EMS to shuffle as crimson or pale green. As soon as you select a multicolor card as a target, it ceases to count as a multicolor card and is counted as the brigade you selected for it. So, it is shuffled (let's count it as crimson), and then you are left with Black, Gold, Gray, Orange, Pale Green as options for shuffling. You then choose The Serpent to shuffle, leaving you with Astrologers in territory. Since Black, Gold, Gray, and Orange are the only evil brigades that have not had a card of theirs shuffled, Astrologers is not shuffled as he is not those colors.


Another scenario: If the opponent only controls Foreign Wives and Silly Women, and you control only Egyptian Rebel and Sapphira, you can select all of them to be shuffled, or, by choosing FW to be gold and SW to be crimson, you shuffle only the opponent's characters.

EMS is still every other brigade even after you select it.

No it isn't. As soon as you realize this, this Q answers itself.

so how does it become 1 single brigade for the purpose of this condition being met?

Two Bears must shuffle all multicolor evil cards like EMS and FW. But as soon as you select it to shuffle, you select a viable color that can be shuffled (orange, pale green, crimson, black, gold, gray, or brown). As soon as you select one of these colors, whatever you selected cannot be targeted again for shuffle.

You band in Heroes one at a time. From how I've always played it, Two Bears shuffles evil cards one at a time. If the only evil cards on the table are your Judas and the opponent's FW, if you select and shuffle FW as crimson, when she's shuffled there are no other evil brigades that Two Bears hasn't shuffled left for it to shuffle. You've met the condition.

Apologies, I cannot explain it more clearly. If the only evil cards on the table were all multicolor like Foreign Wives, then yes, Two Bears would shuffle all of them (assuming there were up to 7).

i mean i understand what everyone is saying here who disagrees with me. i really get it, and i don't take it personally or anything!! so no hard feelings guys!

but the reality is that the card says make a selection, which has to be completely fulfilled before proceeding to shuffle, and unlike what everyone else is saying where ems becomes no longer an optional selection, the fact is that you have to select it as a unique brigade before proceeding to shuffle

If used by a Prophet, interrupt the battle and select one card of each evil brigade in play. (did you select one card of each? they are still on the table to be selected as unique brigades regardless of which you chose them specifically as to begin with or to end with. now is that condition fulfilled?) Shuffle them into owner's deck.

The actual reality is that you're confusing your own arbitrary way of how you think the card works with how the game is actually played.

Okay so for the purposes of this ruling

Two bears is being official errata'd to say select and shuffle one card of each evil brigade in play one at a time?

It actually is two separate things happening

It actually is two separate things happening

It isn't.  "Select an evil brigade" is not a Redemption ability.  "Select an evil brigade" clause tells you how you shuffle.  So you get to shuffle a card with an evil brigade of your choice, and afterwards you get to do it again, assuming a brigade is in play that you haven't shuffled yet.

Okay so that is where the difference lies.. It is in fact select/shuffle, not make a selection as the cards reads, followed by shuffling..

Probably needs an errata imo.. There is a period there between those things happening 

I am using programming logic to try to ultimately get this game into something like Hearthstone one day to greatly streamline the learning process and ease this learning curve we got which I think is a huge barrier.

Probably needs an errata imo.. There is a period there between those things happening 

There are cards on which separate sentences indicate separate abilities. There are also cards on which separate sentences are used to describe how abilities work. Two Bears is clearly the later. You cannot generically apply either method to all cards and expect them all to make sense.

Still sticking to if this is the case that Two Bears could singularly shuffle one multi brigade card for all

It's fine that you feel that way as long as you understand your feelings don't change the game rules or the way cards are played.