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On an unrelated note, do you agree with your coach's statement about Boise State? (We can delete these posts later)

Quite the opposite actually (but it was the university president, not the coach).

http://www.cbssports.com/collegefootball/story/14347652/ohio-state-president-tcu-boise-dont-deserve-title-shot

Perhaps we could start consulting football coaches for rulings.

OK, well, see, that's not something The Vest would say.  But I would disqualify them for their stupid blue turf more than their playing schedule.  That said, I agree with him on the premise that playing New Mexico State, San Jose State, Toledo and Louisiana Tech is not the same as playing Miami, Wisconsin, Penn State, Iowa and Michigan.  Their record will earn them a BCS bowl at the least, and then they can show us if they're worthy of their record.

... unless they get matched up against a Big East team, in which case we won't really learn anything.

We've already learned everything we need to know.  Boise St. beat Oklahoma and Utah kicked the snot out of Alabama in BCS bowl games.  I am getting really sick and tired of the posturing by the Big 6 conferences.  They're starting to remind me of guys like Andrew Carnegie, J.P. Morgan, Rockefeller, Mellon, and the Vanderbilts.  I'm this close to putting college football on the same viewing schedule as the NBA and NHL, which is NEVER.

Quote from: SomeKittens on November 24, 2010, 11:38:27 PM

Perhaps we could start consulting football coaches for rulings.

Entirely kidding.  There's got to be some way to get jocks to play Redemption.

Ask DaClock. I hear he is a football star. I seem to recall that many board members are athletes.

I played football in high school, and while I'm no star baller, the jock block back at school always claimed me as one of their own (often to my dismay).

Boise St. beat Oklahoma...

I meant against GOOD teams.  Beating Oklahoma in a bowl game is like beating Notre Dame in a bowl game.  Personally, I think the two should be banned for life from all future BCS invites.

Be careful what you say around here about a team led by Adrian Peterson.

Led straight to another bowl loss.  Congratulations on that account.

The 2007 Fiesta Bowl was the best college football game I have ever watched, even surpassing Doug Flutie's Hail Mary pass to beat Miami back in the day.

I liked the 2002 Fiesta Bowl better.  Especially having seen it in person.

Besides, we are also talking about Utah, who twice won BCS Bowls. I don't think you can include Alabama in the same context as OK and ND for bowl game ineptitude.

No, I don't.  But I specifically quoted Boise St./OK

Quote from: STAMP on November 24, 2010, 11:50:24 PM

Boise St. beat Oklahoma...

I meant against GOOD teams.  Beating Oklahoma in a bowl game is like beating Notre Dame in a bowl game.  Personally, I think the two should be banned for life from all future BCS invites.

But the Big 6 conferences keep telling us that teams like Oklahoma are far superior to teams like Boise St, Utah, TCU, et al.

But the Big 6 conferences Big 12 Conference keep telling us that teams like Oklahoma are far superior to teams like Boise St, Utah, TCU, et al.

Fixed.  Let's not map their issues onto everyone else; that conference is falling apart as it is.

I suppose that Big 10 losses this year to teams like Toledo, Northern Illinois, and South Dakota were intentional.

But, see, now you're moving the goalposts - no pun intended - from talking about Oklahoma (undeservedly)  being in a BCS game to talking about a 2-9 Minnesota team that's not going to a bowl game at all.  The Big Ten has three top-ten teams this year.  The Big 12 lost two members and I am convinced was a conference call away from being a six-team conference.  If the best you can do is dig up the dregs of the conference against the best of the also-rans (I'd put a top MAC team up against most Big 12 teams any day), then I feel no pressure to back away from my position: The Mighty Big Ten: the Big 12 is no comparison.

Boise State and TCU are worthy to play for the national title, but no matter how good they play they will never be able to play their way into the title game under the BCS system. They must rely on other teams to lose. If Auburn or Oregon don't lose then Boise State and TCU don't deserve to go. Auburn and Oregon have both gone through brutal schedules and the strength of schedule will be the deciding factor if all 4 teams end up undefeated.

Illinois and Purdue were also among the teams who lost to other conferences, not just Minnesota.

Minnesota was the victim of two of the three games you mentioned.  I never said that Minnesota was the only team in the conference with a poor record.  I only mentioned them in a response that applies no less to the other teams you mentioned.

However, you are now the one moving the goalposts (pun intended).

That is an incorrect assessment.  I have not budged at all from my initial assertion.  Let's not forget that a major portion of that position was that Oklahoma was a poor representative from a conference that is a shell of its former self and very nearly ceased to exist as a major conference.  I certainly haven't budged from that.  But the Big 12 being bad doesn't mean Boise St. can hang with top teams from the Big 10 or the SEC.

If the argument of the OSU president (which you seem to support) is that their schedule makes them ineligible, then that argument is lost when teams from their conference play and beat Big Ten teams.

... which are not even going to be in a bowl game of any sort, much less the BCS Championship game.  The point is that the top teams get there by playing and beating other top teams.  Bad teams winning or losing against other bad teams contributes nothing to that equation.

If PAC-10 teams can beat Big Ten teams...

Some PAC 10 teams can beat some Big 10 games, but overall, the PAC 10 isn't that much stronger than the Big 12.  It's decidedly average, about as good as the ACC in my estimation.

Attributing losses from poor Big Ten teams to just a bad year (i.e. Minnesota) is an invalid argument, because those are the same poor teams that are on Ohio State's schedule.

They are also not the teams that I indicated as validating the strength of Ohio State as a team.  They played top teams and beat them.  The team they lost to was a top five team.  Good teams beat good teams to determine who is better.  Bad teams playing bad teams proves nothing about the quality of a good team that plays the same bad team.

I don't recall Ohio State having much more success in bowl games than Oklahoma.

Then you would be wrong.  Ohio State has gone to more BCS games than any other school - 8, and won 5 of them, including a title game.  2 of the 3 they lost were also title games.  Oklahoma has gone 7 times and only won twice, and never since 2003.

After all, they play in the MAC. Looking back now, their stellar QB was probably good enough to beat most top teams. Good 'ole Big Ben.

Roethlisberger is not one of the quarterbacks Ohio State granted the privilege of beating while they were still college phenoms.  Some of the ones that earned that distinction include:
- Phillip Rivers
- Tom Brady
- Drew Brees
- Colt McCoy
- Kyle Orton
- Chad Henne

So he might have been good enough, but there are other factors that would go into whether his team was good enough.  Ohio State, for example, hasn't lost to any team in the MAC conference in the last 19 or 20 years, and their defense lends a lot to that.  Not only Ben would have to be better than one of those teams, but also his receivers, his running backs, and most importantly his o-line.  I'm not worried.

Quote

SEC AND Big 10 AND Big East AND Pac 10 AND Big 12 AND ACC keep telling us that teams like Alabama/Iowa/Pittsburgh/Oregon St./Oklahoma/Florida St. are far superior to teams like Boise St, Utah, TCU, et al.

Fixed again.  They're ALL Robber Barons.

This is another incorrect assessment: none of those teams are ranked above Boise St. or TCU, I don't think any of them are in line for a BCS game this year, and definitely none of them are going to the title game over them.  Utah had one victory against a ranked team, got drilled by TCU and beat soundly by Notre Dame; they've demonstrated they are not one of the two best teams in the country.  This is a pretty bad chip-on-shoulder claim.