Author Topic: The Branch vs Elders of the City (Read 7121 times)

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #25 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:07:00 AM »

"A" is exactly equal to "One."

Master KChief · « **Reply #26 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:09:12 AM »

if 'a' = 'one' and is defined as such by redemption context, and if the branch worked in the way i originally thought, then yeah, i see no reason why you couldnt discard 1.5 giants.

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #27 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:10:08 AM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 01:09:12 AM

if 'a' = 'one' and is defined as such by redemption context, and if the branch worked in the way i originally thought, then yeah, i see no reason why you couldnt discard 1.5 giants.

What card is a half a giant, wouldnt that be a normal sized person?

How do you discard half a card?

Professoralstad · « **Reply #28 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:17:52 AM »

Quote from: Lamborghini_diablo on December 20, 2009, 01:10:08 AM

How do you discard half a card?

Duh. Tear it in half and put half of it in the discard pile.

Minister Polarius · « **Reply #29 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:18:52 AM »

Haman's Giant
12/12 Brown Evil Character
"Rip this card in half to make two half-giants with abilities 6/6."

Master KChief · « **Reply #30 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:19:56 AM »

Quote from: Lamborghini_diablo on December 20, 2009, 01:10:08 AM

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 01:09:12 AM
if 'a' = 'one' and is defined as such by redemption context, and if the branch worked in the way i originally thought, then yeah, i see no reason why you couldnt discard 1.5 giants.

What card is a half a giant, wouldnt that be a normal sized person?

How do you discard half a card?

do you? or dont you?

Lamborghini_diablo · « **Reply #31 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:23:48 AM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 01:19:56 AM

Quote from: Lamborghini_diablo on December 20, 2009, 01:10:08 AM
Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 01:09:12 AM
if 'a' = 'one' and is defined as such by redemption context, and if the branch worked in the way i originally thought, then yeah, i see no reason why you couldnt discard 1.5 giants.

What card is a half a giant, wouldnt that be a normal sized person?

How do you discard half a card?

do you? or dont you?

What?

Master KChief · « **Reply #32 on:** December 20, 2009, 01:32:18 AM »

well, sinning hand is able to discard half a hand, even if that hand is an odd number. i'd say the branch is pretty similiar, even though it doesnt give room for explaining away the decimals. if such a thing were possible, i'd rule to do as much as you can. since you cant discard half an evil character, then you can only discard one.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #33 on:** December 20, 2009, 09:09:45 AM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 19, 2009, 09:44:33 PM

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on December 19, 2009, 09:35:56 PM
OK. But in the mean time, the rest of us will use the REG definition of Increase/Decrease ~~special~~ abilities to make our rulings. In this case, you now have a 9/6 Elders of the City who, if he has a successful RA, will place one EC in your opponent's LoB.

fixed. you still have yet to prove your opening argument.

Sorry, but your "fix" is invalid. Increase/Decrease is a special ability. The quote tells what those special abilities affect, which would be the abilities of the character (which ironically the same REG quote also defines). The one REG quote defines Increase/Decrease Special Abilities and what abilities they affect.

You can't get much more clear than that.

Ryupeco11 · « **Reply #34 on:** December 20, 2009, 09:55:34 AM »

Quote

What card is a half a giant, wouldnt that be a normal sized person?

fallen warrior could be half a giant.

Master KChief · « **Reply #35 on:** December 20, 2009, 02:16:06 PM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on December 20, 2009, 09:09:45 AM

Quote from: Master KChief on December 19, 2009, 09:44:33 PM
Quote from: YourMathTeacher on December 19, 2009, 09:35:56 PM
OK. But in the mean time, the rest of us will use the REG definition of Increase/Decrease ~~special~~ abilities to make our rulings. In this case, you now have a 9/6 Elders of the City who, if he has a successful RA, will place one EC in your opponent's LoB.

fixed. you still have yet to prove your opening argument.

Sorry, but your "fix" is invalid. Increase/Decrease is a special ability. The quote tells what those special abilities affect, which would be the abilities of the character (which ironically the same REG quote also defines). The one REG quote defines Increase/Decrease Special Abilities and what abilities they affect.

You can't get much more clear than that.

sure you can, by saying increase/decrease doesnt affect special abilities, which the REG does not make clear. natch.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #36 on:** December 20, 2009, 04:33:35 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 02:16:06 PM

sure you can, by saying increase/decrease doesnt affect special abilities, which the REG does not make clear. natch.

LOL. The REG would be ten times larger than it already is if every special ability category said what it didn't do as well as what it does do.

I can just imagine a dictionary that included what each word doesn't mean alongside the actual definition.

Master KChief · « **Reply #37 on:** December 20, 2009, 04:51:04 PM »

LOLOLOLOLOLOLOLULZ!!!!1!111!!! or, the REG could just include that increase/decrease only affects abilities. duh.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #38 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:10:52 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 04:51:04 PM

or, the REG could just include that increase/decrease only affects abilities. duh.

It does:

Ongoing Abilities > Increase or Decrease Ability > General Description

These cards increase or decrease the ability (strength and toughness) of characters in a prescribed way.

These cards (cards with an Increase or Decrease Ability) increase or decrease the ability (strength and toughness) of characters (people, demons, animals) in a prescribed way (what the card says to do).

Master KChief · « **Reply #39 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:16:55 PM »

...and then it goes on to list what increase/decrease ability cards there are in redemption. NOTHING MORE. it does not say increase/decrease is EXCLUSIVE to abilities only. im failing to see your point.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #40 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:23:48 PM »

This is what you asked for:

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 04:51:04 PM

or, the REG could just include that increase/decrease only affects abilities. duh.

That's what the REG says.

The REG only says what it affects, not what it doesn't affect. Therefore your point is moot:

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:16:55 PM

it does not say increase/decrease is EXCLUSIVE to abilities only.

It is exclusive to "ability (strength and toughness)" because that is what it says.

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:16:55 PM

im failing to see your point.

You are refusing to see my point. There is a difference.

I think you will find that you see better in the daylight of you are not wearing your night-vision visor.

Master KChief · « **Reply #41 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:31:25 PM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on December 20, 2009, 05:23:48 PM

This is what you asked for:

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 04:51:04 PM
or, the REG could just include that increase/decrease only affects abilities. duh.

That's what the REG says.

The REG only says what it affects, not what it doesn't affect.

really? where? because i dont see the word only ANYWHERE. i see nothing that even suggests increase/decrease is exclusive only to numbered abilities. what i see is a LIST of cards that increase/decrease numbered abilities.

Quote

It is exclusive to "ability (strength and toughness)" because that is what it says.

nowhere does it say that.

and for the record, NVGs own.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #42 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:34:47 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:31:25 PM

and for the record, NVGs own.

...just not in the daylight.

A different analogy:

You are looking for an answer in English. However, the REG is written in Spanish. You refuse to learn Spanish, so those of us who speak Spanish translate the REG for you. However, that was not the answer you wanted to hear, so now you have decided that since the REG does not have the answer in English, it does not have the answer at all.

Master KChief · « **Reply #43 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:42:45 PM »

let me break it down...

Ongoing Abilities > Increase or Decrease (up or down) Ability (what it affects) > General Description

These cards increase or decrease the ability (strength and toughness) of characters in a prescribed way.

where does this even suggest that increasing and decreasing is EXCLUSIVE ONLY TO ABILITIES? that is what im asking. that is what you are failing to prove. that is what you CANNOT PROVE, BECAUSE IT IS NOT THERE. does it say increase/decrease ONLY affects strength and toughness? no. this was not proven to be the case until maly ruled. does the above REG excerpt say what maly said? no? ok then.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #44 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:48:47 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:42:45 PM

this was not proven to be the case until maly ruled. does the above REG excerpt say what maly said? no? ok then.

Quote from: SirNobody on December 19, 2009, 07:38:47 PM

The Branch has an increase/decrease ability. Increase/decrease abilities affect strength and toughness.

What is it that Maly said that the REG did not?

Master KChief · « **Reply #45 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:50:28 PM »

he made increase/decrease exclusive to number abilities only.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #46 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:51:29 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:50:28 PM

he made increase/decrease exclusive to number abilities only.

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:42:45 PM

where does this even suggest that increasing and decreasing is EXCLUSIVE ONLY TO ABILITIES? that is what im asking. that is what you are failing to prove. that is what you CANNOT PROVE, BECAUSE IT IS NOT THERE. does it say increase/decrease ONLY affects strength and toughness? no.

SirNobody · « **Reply #47 on:** December 20, 2009, 05:55:55 PM »

Hey,

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 05:42:45 PM

Ongoing Abilities > Increase or Decrease (up or down) Ability (what it affects) > General Description

These cards increase or decrease the ability (strength and toughness) of characters in a prescribed way.

where does this even suggest that increasing and decreasing is EXCLUSIVE ONLY TO ABILITIES?

While it probably doesn't say this anywhere in the Rulebook or REG, if the rules or a special ability don't say that you can do something, then you can't do it. Redemption has an "illegal until proven legal" ideology. So the onus is on MKC to show where the rules say Increase/Decrease abilities can affect special abilities rather than on YMT to show where the rules say that they can't.

Tschow,

Tim "Sir Nobody" Maly

Master KChief · « **Reply #48 on:** December 20, 2009, 06:01:52 PM »

i did it by adding two and two together. branch says to increase the [abilities] by 50% of the value printed on the card. on ttl, [abilities] = [special abilities]. adding both together, what do you get? there was my proof.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #49 on:** December 20, 2009, 06:05:29 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on December 20, 2009, 06:01:52 PM

i did it by adding two and two together. branch says to increase the [abilities] by 50% of the value printed on the card. on ttl, [abilities] = [special abilities]. adding both together, what do you get? there was my proof.

TTL is not an Increase/Decrease Ability card. The REG entry for Increase/Decrease Ability cards (which The Branch is) specifically states that [abilities]=[strength and toughness].

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Author Topic: The Branch vs Elders of the City (Read 7121 times)

Lamborghini_diablo

Lamborghini_diablo