Author Topic: Satans Folly  (Read 2036 times)

Offline Alpho

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Satans Folly
« on: February 22, 2010, 10:29:31 AM »
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I have a question about this card. The card says:

Satan’s Folly

Type: Hero Enh. • Brigade: White • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: If one of holder's Heroes is about to be discarded, Holder may substitute an Evil Character from an opponent's territory in place of the Hero being discarded. • Errata: If a Hero is discarded later in this battle, discard an Evil Character in an opponent’s territory to heal that Hero. • Identifiers: None • Verse: Colossians 2:15 • Availability: Apostles booster packs (Ultra Rare)

Does that mean if I use a dominant to discard a hero my opponet can play this card and discard my evil character instead?

Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #1 on: February 22, 2010, 10:33:35 AM »
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Due to the Errata, Satan's Folly has to be played before the discard card is played. So if you play Satan's Folly on your hero and then your opponent uses Christian Martyr, you can discard an EC in an opponent's territory. But if your opponent plays Christian Martyr on your hero, you can't reactively play Satan's Folly to heal your hero like you can with other healing cards
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Offline Alpho

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #2 on: February 22, 2010, 10:39:48 AM »
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Let me just get this clear. Lets say it is my discard phase and it is not even his turn yet. I play Christian Martyr on his hero. Can he play Satan's Folly even though it is not his turn? What If I played Christian Martyr on his hero in battle, could he play it even though he might not have initiative?

Ironica

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #3 on: February 22, 2010, 10:45:39 AM »
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Let me just get this clear. Lets say it is my discard phase and it is not even his turn yet. I play Christian Martyr on his hero. Can he play Satan's Folly even though it is not his turn? What If I played Christian Martyr on his hero in battle, could he play it even though he might not have initiative?

Satan's folly is not a real healing card so it can't be played outside of battle.  Also, as mentioned above, the person with the hero has to play Satan's Folly before Christian Martyr is played.  Even though it does saves you from being discarded, it still must follow all rules on playing regular enhancements.

Offline CountFount

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #4 on: February 22, 2010, 10:47:23 AM »
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Let me just get this clear. Lets say it is my discard phase and it is not even his turn yet. I play Christian Martyr on his hero. Can he play Satan's Folly even though it is not his turn? What If I played Christian Martyr on his hero in battle, could he play it even though he might not have initiative?

Satan's folly is not a real healing card so it can't be played outside of battle.  Also, as mentioned above, the person with the hero has to play Satan's Folly before Christian Martyr is played.  Even though it does saves you from being discarded, it still must follow all rules on playing regular enhancements.

Wouldn't that be interrupting CM's ability?
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The Schaef

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2010, 10:54:14 AM »
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No.  It's "insteading" it.

The ability is not interrupted or stopped in any way.  It just says if you try to discard this character, you end up discarding that other character instead.

Offline Korunks

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2010, 11:01:36 AM »
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I think Satan's Folly needs a new play as, first its current one is confusing and the card is useless.  I propose it be some thing like:  "Discard an Evil Character in an opponent’s territory to heal a Hero that was or is about to be discarded."  This I feel is more consistent with the original wording, and makes it more useful.
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Ironica

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2010, 11:06:02 AM »
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Well, besides when CM is played, you could use an ITB and then play it :).

Offline Korunks

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2010, 11:09:49 AM »
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No Dominants cannot be interrupted.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2010, 11:18:08 AM by Korunks »
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Ironica

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2010, 11:16:40 AM »
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No Dominants cannot be interuppted.

Hence why I said besides when CM is played.

Offline Korunks

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2010, 11:18:58 AM »
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 :doh: Read to fast, whoops.
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Offline CountFount

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2010, 11:20:00 AM »
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How do you know to play it when it is 'about to be discarded'? Is it just poorly worded? It reminds me of Enoch's ability.
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Offline Korunks

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2010, 11:30:42 AM »
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Since the card has an errata ignore the text on the card, just go by what the REG says. However,

<Rant>
"about to be discarded" is 'translated' inconsistently in the Redemption Universe.  In this case it translates to discarded in the future, but on other cards like David's harp it translates to was discarded as well.  Further some cards like Elisha's bones have no play as or errata and still say "about to be discarded" which is hard to understand, does that make it a healing card?  Who knows what it means?  I think Satan's Folly errata is a folly, and should be changed and all cards who target a character "about to be discarded" be treated in the same way for consistency sake.
</Rant>
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2010, 11:52:37 AM »
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"About to be discarded" and "is being discarded" are the same thing. The about to be discarded terminology came from the old days, when Elisha's Bones and Bread of Life were the preeminent healing cards, and when most discarded heroes came as a result of not having enough toughness to face Goliath; very few abilities actually discarded heroes, aside from CM. Satan's folly only works differently than other healing cards because of the "later this battle" part of it, which means that it must be played before the hero is discarded, not while it is happening.

I don't foresee SF getting any further errata/Play As anytime soon. It is functional (although, as you said, mostly useless) as is, but then again, a lot of cards share that same fate.
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Offline Alpho

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #14 on: February 22, 2010, 12:16:01 PM »
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Wow! I learned a lot. Thanks everyone!

The Schaef

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #15 on: February 22, 2010, 01:34:53 PM »
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In this case it translates to discarded in the future, but on other cards like David's harp it translates to was discarded as well.

The reason for that is that it is an Enhancement that has to be played in battle, and therefore, you can't play it on your character if he was already discarded.

David's Harp may be triggered BY a battle with a discarded character, but you made it your active Artifact beforehand.  So in that regard they work the same.

Offline Korunks

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Re: Satans Folly
« Reply #16 on: February 22, 2010, 02:15:46 PM »
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But it was a healing card, so it could be played outside of battle.
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