Author Topic: How EXACTLY does the CBN granting part of Joy work???  (Read 184 times)

RoboPat10

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How EXACTLY does the CBN granting part of Joy work???
« on: May 03, 2020, 11:51:18 PM »
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I know this question has been covered a bit, but I believe the previous discussions missed something important.  These previous discussions seem to say that Joy will make the hero (say The Watchful Leaders) CBN as long as Joy is on the hero each time its ability activates (i.e. every time the hero enters battle for non T-class heroes such as TWL).  What seems to be overlooked in this scenario is the fact that Joy appears to strongly imply a gain effect.  In other words, I believe Joy should be read as follows: "Place on your clay or white hero: increase hero 7/0.  Hero gains 'cannot be negated.'  Protect clay and white heroes from decrease."  According to the REG, "a gain effect is permanent unless a duration is specified" and "all gain effects are instant."  Thus, since Joy is strongly implying a gain effect with regard to the CBN granting portion, shouldn't the hero's special ability be permanently CBN once the ability activates with Joy on the hero even if the hero later enters battle without Joy???

Joy: Place on your clay or white hero: increase hero 7/0.  That hero's special ability cannot be negated.  Protect clay and white heroes from decrease.

The Watchful Leader: May band to a hero from the same church as this hero.  Protect that hero from harm.
« Last Edit: May 03, 2020, 11:55:18 PM by RoboPat10 »

Offline RedemptionAggie

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Re: How EXACTLY does the CBN granting part of Joy work???
« Reply #1 on: May 04, 2020, 12:25:53 AM »
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Usually, modifiers (like CBN) are just granted, not gained, because the gain can technically be negated, negating the modifier.

Also, the "Place on [target]:" provides a duration for everything that follows, so even if the CBN was gained, the place duration overrides the permanence of the gain, so it would be lost when Joy is removed.
« Last Edit: May 04, 2020, 01:46:20 AM by RedemptionAggie »

RoboPat10

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Re: How EXACTLY does the CBN granting part of Joy work???
« Reply #2 on: May 04, 2020, 02:28:59 PM »
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Ah...I definitely overlooked the fact that the place effect would have to by default be giving a duration for the rest of the abilities.  That makes a lot more sense now.  Thanks