Author Topic: How can we know God from observing Nature?  (Read 1472 times)

Offline Prof Underwood

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How can we know God from observing Nature?
« on: January 10, 2013, 10:05:50 PM »
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Romans 1:20 For since the creation of the world His invisible attributes, His eternal power and divine nature, have been clearly seen, being understood through what has been made, so that they are without excuse.[/quote]

How can this verse be true? How can someone be responsible to know "God's divine nature" based only on nature?

I will try to answer this in a series of posts, as I have many thoughts on this. First a little background about myself. I worked for most of a decade as a research scientist, and most of another decade as a science teacher.  Therefore I have spent a lot of time studying the world around me and the scientific theories about the universe. The result of this study has been that I believe that just examining nature around us "shows" us who God is.

Notice that I don't say "proves". It is been my experience that nothing can actually be "proven". In life, we must make choices about what we "believe". And it is most logical to choose to believe what is more likely than what is less likely. For instance, the theory of gravity has never been actually "proven". However, our vast experience of seeing effects indicating its presence (ie. seeing balls drop, etc.) and its ability to fit into other scientific theories make it a much more logical to believe in gravity, than to disbelieve it. Therefore, we live our lives based on it being true (ie. we don't jump off tall buildings, thinking that we won't fall).

Similarly, I have found that on every issue where we must choose what we believe, one option is more reasonable than any others. Therefore, in this series of posts I will try to explain why I find Christianity to be the most logical choice of belief.

Offline Prof Underwood

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #1 on: January 10, 2013, 10:08:11 PM »
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When I look at the world the first thing that I notice is that it exists. I know this is obvious, but it is important. I also know that it is illogical for something to exist without having a beginning. So how did everything get here?

One must believe that either it was always here and had no beginning, or "Something" else was always here and made everything. Now since it is illogical for anything to exist without beginning, then the most logical answer would be that only one "Thing" broke this logic as opposed to all things breaking the logic. In other words, it makes more sense to believe that only one "Power" always existed than to believe that the star in the sky, and the bird in the air, and rock on the ground, etc. have always existed (in some form of either energy or matter).

Similarly, the existence of nature leads one to believe that there is an Eternal Power, who created the universe, because it is the most logical explanation.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #2 on: January 10, 2013, 10:09:09 PM »
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The second thing that I notice about the universe is that there is an enormous amount of energy and matter in it. The laws of entropy state that systems always go from a state of order and high energy to a state of disorder and low energy. A good example of this is a child's bedroom, but we can see this in nature constantly.

The lesson that we learn from this is that it is not possible for a creative force to make something with more energy than it had to begin with. Therefore, the "Eternal Power" that made the universe must have more power than all the energy in the universe combined. In fact, that "Eternal Power" must be practically infinitely powerful. Thus one can learn that there is an "Omnipotent, Eternal Power".
« Last Edit: January 10, 2013, 10:22:25 PM by Prof Underwood »

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2013, 10:10:47 PM »
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The third thing that I notice about nature is how complicated it is. From my studies in biology, chemistry, anatomy, physiology, and physics, I have seen how we humans have only begun to understand the complexities of the world around us. Yet it is not even neccessary to have this level of education. Just from experience of watching seasons change, flowers bloom, and children grow, one can clearly see the how much more intellegent the "Omnipotent, Eternal Power" must be than we humans.

In fact, the more one learns about how the entire world is connected and interacts, the more impressed one becomes. Then, by extrapolating that to the entire universe, it becomes clear that the "Omnioptent, Eternal Power" must also be of practically infinite intellegence. Therefore, nature shows us that there is an "Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Power".

This brings us to an important point. Now that we have discovered these things from nature, we can now begin to call this "Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Power", a being. The fact that there is that level of intellegence forces us to accept that this Power is a living persona. And being so much smarter, more powerful than humans, as well as breaking the laws of nature (by always existing) would cause us to classify this being as "supernatural".

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #4 on: January 10, 2013, 10:11:48 PM »
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Summarizing the last four posts, nature has shown that there is an "Supernatural, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Being" (S,O,O,E,B). The fourth thing that I observe about nature is that the universe has been created in a way that values life. In fact, it appears that the S,O,O,E,B has done so much to sustain life, that it is most reasonable to believe that this being cares extremely about that life.

There are many examples, but let me share just a couple. On a large scale, if our planet were just slightly (on a interplanetary scale) closer to or farther from the sun, there would be no life on Earth. On a smaller scale, let's think about density. Almost all materials on earth become more dense as they get colder. However, there is one notable exception in nature to this rule of science, and it is water. This is due to complicated issues dealing with molecular bonds, and energy levels of electrons in molecules, but that isn't the point. The question is not how does this happen, but why does this happen. Why would the S,O,O,E,B create practically everything else one way, and then make water differently?

The only reasonable answer that I can come up with is that is saves life. Think about a pond or even lake that is filled with fish. If water was like everyhing else, and became more dense, then there would be serious problems in the winter. The top layer of water would freeze and sink to the bottom, then the next layer would freeze and sink to the bottom. This would keep happening until the entire pond or lake was frozen, and all the life in it was dead. But this is not what happens. As you know from seeing ice cubes float in your drink, the frozen water becomes less dense, and floats on the top of the pond or lake. This creates a shield from the cold, and keeps the rest of the pond or lake from freezing. Thus all the fish and plants are able to survive.

Therefore, nature shows that there is an S,O,O,E,B, who cares extremely about all life.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #5 on: January 10, 2013, 10:12:45 PM »
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So if this "Supernatural, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Being" (S,O,O,E,B) values the life of a fish or even water scum on the bottom of a pond, what are Their thoughts about humanity? One of the first things that a person learns in science class at school or through pure observation is the food chain. The cow eats the grass, the human eats the cow. The fish eats the plankton, the duck eats the fish, the human eats the duck. There are of course many different food chains, however, it quickly becomes obvious that humans are at the top.

This observation, even made by a completely uneducated tribesman on an island somewhere, points to the fact that the Earth is designed for supporting humanity. Of course the regretful thing about this is that often humanity has gotten a big head about the whole thing and concluded that they were the ultimate creature in the universe (humanism). However, this discovery does show us just how much the S,O,O,E,B cares about us. In fact, based on how much the S,O,O,E,B cares about pond scum, a good case can be made through extrapolation that it approaches "Love" by the level of humanity.

Therefore, from just observing nature, one can discover that it is most logical to believe that there is a Being who is Supernatural, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal, and who values all life, but most of all cares about humanity.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #6 on: January 10, 2013, 10:13:31 PM »
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We are now ready for the next critical jump in our reasoning. From nature we have learned that there is a Supernatural, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Being, who values all life, but most of all cares about humanity. The question is, "Would such a Being desire a relationship with the supreme creation that had been made, and that was cared so deeply about?" I think that it is most logical to assume that this desire is true. I find it very improbable that any being would go to such lengths to create something (especially something with the capability for forming relationships) and then just leave it alone.

All relationships are based on communication, so the question becomes, "how would this S,O,O,E,B who loves humanity communicate with us?" There are I think four main ways that would make sense.

1. First of all the S,O,O,E,B could have left signs in the nature around us. I think this is true, and is what got us to this point to begin with.

2. A second way would be to actually come visit humanity in person. The difficulty here would be that if the S,O,O,E,B came in his natural state it would be like one of us visiting an ant hill. We would be so much bigger, stronger, smarter, etc., that the ants would be completely unable to comprehend our purpose or even what we were. Of course, the S,O,O,E,B could take the form of a human, but that would mean other problems. For instance, he could only be at one place at a time, so it wouldn't be an efficient way to communicate with the entire world of people.

3. The S,O,O,E,B could just directly communicate with the minds of all the individual humans. However, if this was done to a slight enough degree that it didn't blow their brains, it could also be misunderstood. Also the S,O,O,E,B would have to repeat the process over and over to each person. This would get extremely redundant.

4. The fourth way, and in my opinion the most likely way, would be to send a more permanent message that could be shared with all the people in the world. This could also have the important benefit of being consistent throughout time so that all people would receive the same message. It could be accomplished by a letter or book.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #7 on: January 10, 2013, 10:14:20 PM »
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Just to recap so far, we have learned that there is a Supernatural, Omniscient, Omnipotent, Eternal Being, who values all life, but most of all cares about humanity. We have also figured out that it is most likely that this S,O,O,E,B would communicate in some way with humanity about Themself. For simplicity, I will now call this being "god" with a lower case "g". It is not necessarily the Judeo/Christian God, but is definately a god of some sort.

The problem is that there are myriads of religions in the world that all claim to reveal the communication of god to mankind. So the next question is, "Out of all the religions of the world, how do we know which one expresses the TRUE communication of the god?" The best way to go about this is process of elimination.

The first thing that I would point out is that based on the qualities that we have already discovered about god, it is reasonable to assume that such an intellegent and powerful being would be able to communicate effectively. The importance of this is that the vast majority of religions in the world are very small, and only a few people believe in them. It seems most likely that if the true message of god was found in one of these small religions, that god would be very unsatisfied with the small number of people who were getting the message and would try something different.

Therefore, it seems most likely that one of the major world religions (Buddism, Christianity, Hinduism, and Islam) would contain this TRUE message of god.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2013, 10:15:13 PM »
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So if god's message is in one of the major world religions, which one is it? Once again the process of elimination is very helpful.

Hinduism the most unlike the other three, because it is polytheistic. Going back to the very beginning of our thinking, we figured out that it made the most sense to have as few things as possible existing without a beginning. Similarly, having a whole bunch of gods makes a lot less sense than just having one. There are of course other reasons why Hinduism doesn't make sense, but this is a good enough reason to look elsewhere.

This leaves Buddhism, Christianity, and Islam. Of these three, it is interesting to note that Buddhism and Islam are both based on a person (Budda and Mohommed respectively) who, during there lives, told people not to worship them because they were not God. Both religions also base their salvation on specific works that a person does. And most importantly Both religions worship a god that is impersonal. They do not teach that god loves them but that god is to be simply feared and obeyed. This does not fit the characteristics of god that we have found by looking at nature, therefore, I think that once again, we must look elsewhere.

The last major religion is Christianity. So what does it say about God?

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2013, 10:16:11 PM »
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So how do the beliefs of Christianity about God line up with the characteristics that we can learn about god from nature? To discover this, let's compare our own observations about god with what the Bible says.

Nature shows us that god is eternal. Romans 1:20 says, "For since the creation of the world God's invisible qualities--his eternal power and divine nature--have been clearly seen, being understood from what has been made, so that men are without excuse."

Nature shows us that god is omnipotent. Jeremiah 32:17 says, "Ah, Sovereign LORD, you have made the heavens and the earth by your great power and outstretched arm. Nothing is too hard for you."

Nature shows us that god is omniscient. Psalms 147:4-5 says, "He determines the number of the stars and calls them each by name. Great is our Lord and mighty in power; his understanding has no limit."

Nature shows us that god values life. Mathew 10:29-31 says, "Are not two sparrows sold for a penny? Yet not one of them will fall to the ground apart from the will of your Father. And even the very hairs of your head are all numbered. So don't be afraid; you are worth more than many sparrows."

Nature shows us that god loves humanity. 1 John 4:8 says,"Whoever does not love does not know God, because God is love."

Nature shows us that god wants to communicate with us. Hebrews 1:1-2 says, "In many and various ways God spoke of old to our fathers by the prophets; but in these last days he has spoken to us by a Son, whom he appointed the heir of all things, through whom also he created the world." In addition, the entire Bible claims to be the message of God to mankind.

It quickly becomes appearant then the the God of the Bible has the exact same characteristics that we know to look for from observing nature. Therefore, the most logical religion to choose to believe is Christianity. To choose to believe in any other religion, or even in no religion at all, is therefore unreasonable.

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Re: How can we know God from observing Nature?
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2013, 10:18:19 PM »
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So to wrap up everything, the God of the Bible is the only TRUE god.

The Bible is God's message to mankind, and everything in it is true and authoritative for our lives.

Therefore, Jesus Christ is the Son of God, and the only way to come to a healthy relationship with God.

Therefore, this is done by confessing our sins, trusting in Jesus to save us from the punishment for them.

Therefore, it is also essential to commit ouselves to God by allowing Jesus to be Lord of our lives, and with the help of the Holy Spirit, to live according to His will.

If you have any questions about any of these points, please feel free to contact me personally through PM.

 


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