Author Topic: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies  (Read 1992 times)

Offline AJ

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Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« on: May 05, 2014, 09:24:19 PM »
0
Anyone else excited? I really can't wait to see if it has the council's raid on Dol Guldur. Also really can't wait to see Bard kill Smaug. Also, as a total guess, Tauriel is going to croak like an Uzzah against a TSA.
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Chris

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2014, 09:28:23 PM »
+5
It's going to be the best of the three, and still a pretty bad movie all in all.

Offline yirgogo

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2014, 09:41:43 PM »
+1
It's going to be the best of the three, and still a pretty bad movie all in all.
They didn't make them like the lord of the rings. They should've just followed the books exactly, same with Eragon and every other book made into movie there is.
"All we have to decide is what to do with the time that is given us." Lord of the Rings, JRR Tolkien

Chris

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2014, 10:15:24 PM »
+3
The film trilogy of the Lord of the Rings is very different from the books. The issue with the Hobbit is horrible pacing more than it is anything else. I was a big believer in the Hobbit as three movies, but it's clear it should have been two now.

Offline Minion of Jesus

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #4 on: May 05, 2014, 10:16:56 PM »
+1
It's going to be the best of the three, and still a pretty bad movie all in all.

It's going to be the best because...

Spoiler (hover to show)
To the Pain!

-Wesley

TheMarti

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2014, 12:29:08 PM »
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The film trilogy of the Lord of the Rings is very different from the books. The issue with the Hobbit is horrible pacing more than it is anything else. I was a big believer in the Hobbit as three movies, but it's clear it should have been two now.

Yeah, I felt the same way about it, too Chris. I got the idea behind three movies, but two movies would have flowed better and it would have eliminated some of the "dead space" that I felt like we got in the second movie.

Offline joeychips

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2014, 12:53:31 PM »
+1
I happen to like what they added to the movies. (the book was a little slow)
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Offline Minion of Jesus

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2014, 01:01:38 PM »
+3
I happen to like what they added to the movies. (the book was a little slow)

The book was written by an author who wasn't interested in making a fast-paced book. I really, really, hated (erm, disliked) the stuff they added.

The fight scenes are ridiculous. How do dwarves and elves ever lose any battles?

The River scene. Everything was wrong. Laws of movement were broken.

Spoiler (hover to show)

Thorin is too much of a jerk.

What is with Smaug not killing the dwarves the 20,000 times he has the chance? He talks to them instead.

That's only a few problems.
To the Pain!

-Wesley

Offline Minion of Jesus

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2014, 01:34:39 PM »
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More.

Spoiler (hover to show)

Azog would be dead. He DID die at the battle where Thorin cut off his hand.

The actor of Thranduil over emotes.

You don't care about any of the characters, because you never feel even remotely afraid for their lives.

Humor wasn't funny. (Except for the crack about Gimli and Gloin's wife)

Spoiler (hover to show)

Spoiler (hover to show)

Spoiler (hover to show)

I will not list any more, as I there would be 20 more pages.

I like the idea of trying to put in the stuff with Dol Guldur, but they failed.
« Last Edit: May 06, 2014, 01:38:54 PM by Minion of Jesus »
To the Pain!

-Wesley

Offline soul seeker

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2014, 02:17:32 PM »
+2
Why do I get the sense in this thread that you guys are comparing Star Wars Prequels to Star Wars Original Trilogy, but using different nouns and pronouns?    :o    lol    :maul:


You guys take this stuff seriously.   :kenobi:


Of course, you guys can remind me of my words when Star Wars 7 comes out.   :thumbup:


Oh, and Chris & Alex, May the Fourth be with you......belated.     8)

 :grouphug:
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Warrior_Monk

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #10 on: May 06, 2014, 03:00:36 PM »
+2
Should I start listing everything wrong with Lord of the Rings?
Aragorn had Anduril the whole time! Why did they make it a Hero's Journey story!? So lame!
What was with Arwen rescuing Frodo?! She doesn't even know how to fight! It doesn't make sense! Glorfindel was way cooler.
It seems like the Fellowship knew where they were going, but in reality Gandalf was just making it up along the way! In fact, Boromir and Aragorn were really just going to go to Gondor the entire time, and were along with the company only until then. So bad! Would Elrond honestly send Boromir for an extended time with the Ring? Of course not.
Oh, and that's another thing. In the movies whoever wants to go just goes, but there's no way Elrond and Gandalf would allow that. They hand picked the Fellowship, only using the ones they trusted.
Gandalf never mentioned to Frodo that Gollum was following them, and he didn't fully figure it out until he conferred with Aragorn after Lothlorien. I'm not sure why this is important.
On that note, the Uruks didn't just randomly find the Fellowship, which is quite ridiculous, Gollum lead them to them.
And let's not forget Tom Bombadil like they did...

And that's just a few of the problems in Fellowship.

While you can pick over things like "humor wasn't funny", or the fight scenes being ridiculous, saying things like "Azog would be dead. He DID die at the battle where Thorin cut off his hand." is off the table if you enjoyed LotR. I thought Azog was a great touch to the first movie.

"Gandalf is the single greatest threat to Sauron that exists" is just blatantly false, as well as "Tauriel healing Kili with Athelas. Only the king of Gondor or his kin can use Athelas for healing properties. Otherwise, it is useless. Not some random elf babe."

Offline Minion of Jesus

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #11 on: May 06, 2014, 03:33:12 PM »
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I'm not saying the LOTR movies were perfect. But they were far and away above the Hobbit movies.

I totally agree with the stuff you mentioned about Tom Bombadil and Glorfindel being left out.

Azog did die at the battle of Moria. Have you read any of the appendices? They overdid Azog. They should have introduced him at the end of the first movie, without anything before that.

Actually, without Gandalf, the world would have fallen. Maybe I did exaggerate, since Eru is a bigger opponent. But on Earth, Gandalf is the greatest. That aside, Sauron would STILL have killed Gandalf. (Sorry, I have a tendency to dramatize and exxagerate when I get excited) Athelas does nothing except in the hands of the men of Numenor.

To the Pain!

-Wesley

Warrior_Monk

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #12 on: May 06, 2014, 03:43:44 PM »
+1
Oh, I know the inaccuracies in the movie, such as Azog dying, but they were just as present if not more present in The Hobbit. Don't even get me started on how inaccurate the Two Towers was...

The point is that the movie is a different medium, and is therefore going to be a different story.  They have the right to change it and I'm glad they did. The movie shouldn't be the same as the book. There shouldn't be gigantic differences (like imagine if they killed Aragorn instead of Gandalf), but little things are fine (like Azog still being alive...he wasn't crucial to the story other than giving background on Bolg and Thorin's rivalry, which will still be there).

The first movie would have been incredibly dull without Azog. Tom Bombadil was entirely unnecessary, and even Tolkien acknowledged that. 

Eru is largely disengaged from Middle Earth, as far as we know. Ulmo was probably the most active of the Valar at that point.

As for Athelas, I'll need a source on that. Aragorn straight up tells Sam that he should use it on Frodo.
"They are dry and some of their virtue has one, he said, but here I have still some of the leaves of athelas that I gathered near
Weathertop. Crush one in the water, and wash the wound clean, and I will bind it. Now it is your turn. Frodo!"

Offline Minion of Jesus

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #13 on: May 06, 2014, 04:22:53 PM »
-1
... And later, only Aragorn can heal Merry and Eowyn of the Black Breath, using Athelas. "The hands of the King are the hands of a healer."

The Two Towers did take quite a few creative liberties. They just didn't want to introduce Erkenbrand, so they threw in Elves. It was weird how they had Aragorn "die."

Why couldn't Bolg have been the main orc all along instead of Azog? Since he isn't anything more then a commander in the movie, why not have him be there and exclude Azog altogether?

I know that. I was just saying, Gandalf is the biggest opponent Sauron has that will readily engage him.

Tom Bombadil isn't necessary, but that doesn't make him any less cool. He is like Adam. Also, they should have had the Barrow-Wights, so they could explain how Merry's knife so damaged the Witch-King.
To the Pain!

-Wesley

Warrior_Monk

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Re: Hobbit: The Battle of 5 Armies
« Reply #14 on: May 06, 2014, 05:00:37 PM »
+1
Obviously, spoilers are ahead.

I mean, there's no question that Aragorn knows the art of healing, but I'm still not convinced somebody like the elves, who also know it, couldn't use it.

Re: Bolg/Azog. This is pure speculation because we haven't seen the final film, but here's my guess as to what they were trying to do with everything.
A. Make Thorin and Azog rivals by Azog slaying Thror and Thorin failing to avenge his grandfather, but making Azog angry by cutting off his arm. This brings tension to the first film and a physical bad guy (as opposed to just thinking about the dragon later on, and the one bout with the goblins).
B. Connect the main story line to Dol Guldor by sending Azog to the service of the Necromancer.
C. Continue the tension by keeping Bolg in the story, chasing after Thorin on behalf of Azog.
D. Necromancer sends Azog and the rest to the Battle of Five Armies, reuniting the original tension.
E. Wrap it up nicely by having Thorin kill Azog, and then having Thorin (and Fili/Kili) die to the hands of Bolg.

I'm not going to continue on the Gandalf tangent and instead keep to the bulk of the argument.  Which is...

They didn't have time to go into so much detail because it's a movie, and that restricts everything. Movies are meant to be watched in one sitting (unlike books), and while splitting up the Hobbit made sense, I'm not sure LotR could have been done effectively since it's already a trilogy. Yes, things were dropped, but it was necessary to do such and didn't detract from the film because it's not a book. LotR did this effectively, and I think once all is said and done, The Hobbit will do okay too. That remains to be seen though.  They did go a bit overboard on the fight scenes.