Author Topic: Never ending battles!  (Read 2302 times)

Offline Ironisaac

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Never ending battles!
« on: April 13, 2018, 11:30:27 AM »
+3
Ruth (j)
Naomi (j)
Boaz (j)
Elders of the city (j)
The Woman with Child
Justin Martyr
Jephthah's Daughter
Ibzan
The Angel of the Winds

Kinsmen's Agreement
Death of Family
Lamenting in the Mountains
Family Bond
Gleaning the Fields
Loyalty of Ruth
Ruth meets Boaz

Boaz's Sandal
You Will Remain

Reserve
Jephathah
Blood of the Lamb
Word of Their Testimony

I don't have a defense for this one, nor have i tested it at all, but it seems pretty powerful with so many battle extenders. Death of Family, You will Remain, Boaz's Sandal, and Jephthah will all make sure you always have a hero in battle. I think it may need one more gold enhancement, and maybe swap out Loyalty for Devotion of Ruth, but I think this definitely has a shot to do well this year. Also, Lamenting is cbn on Ibzan, just throwing that out there.  ;)   
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Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2018, 01:56:09 PM »
+1
So, when I originally made this deck list, I didn't notice the Unity on Death of Family, so I have a slightly different list now. I'd take out Justin Martyr and The Woman with Child as they break the unity, and replace them with Angel with a Secret Name, for cbn judges enhancements, and othniel for low numbers and grabbing judges enhancements from the reserve. I'd put Deborah's Directive, Brother Against Brother, Dancing Wives and Sin and Justice in the reserve for sure, and you can put other things in, it's just personal preference. Those white judges enhancements are really nice because they can be used by the ruth characters and recurred by the Gleaning the Fields.     

I'd also like to mention that Abdon is actually pretty good in this deck if you include the three new white judges enhancements as he could use them and AWSN makes them CBN.

Also, Ibzan is very good even if you have no enhancements for him as long as you have a way to get a white hero in battle and have some of those white judges enhancements in your hand. He just makes all good judges enhancements cbn, so if he dies and you get a white hero in battle from Death of family, Sandal, or YWR, all the white judges enhancements are still cbn.   
« Last Edit: April 20, 2018, 02:22:39 PM by Ironisaac »
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Offline Xonathan

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2018, 02:02:09 PM »
+1
So, when I originally made this deck list, I didn't notice the Unity on Death of Family, so I have a slightly different list now. I'd take out Justin Martyr and The Woman with Child as they break the unity, and replace them with Angel with a Secret Name, for cbn judges enhancements, and othniel for low numbers and grabbing judges enhancements from the reserve. I'd put Deborah's Directive, Brother Against Brother, Dancing Wives and Sin and Justice in the reserve for sure, and you can put other things in, it's just personal preference. Those white judges enhancements are really nice because they can be used by the ruth characters and recurred by the Gleaning the Fields.     

Is the unity only important at the time of activation for placed enhancement? For example, I only have OT heroes in territory and I play Death of Family. Then I play down Justin Martyr. Does death of Family turn off then?
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Offline Gabe

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2018, 02:08:27 PM »
+1
Is the unity only important at the time of activation for placed enhancement? For example, I only have OT heroes in territory and I play Death of Family. Then I play down Justin Martyr. Does death of Family turn off then?

Excellent question! I don't think this has been discussed among our team. I assume that a check for unity is made both when the special ability is activated (place) and when the trigger is used (add to battle).
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Offline The Guardian

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2018, 02:10:07 PM »
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I would concur with that line of thinking.
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Offline RedemptionAggie

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2018, 04:12:03 PM »
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We discussed this briefly with Golden Calf Worship, since it is ongoing, and I think we decided unity was an ongoing condition, if needed. Which functions basically as Gabe and Guardian said in this case.

Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #6 on: April 24, 2018, 11:12:39 AM »
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Below is my updated offense. I'm not sure what to run for the defense though, anyone have any ideas? I was thinking maybe sadducees, as they actually got some pretty good NT black enhancements in this set between Wages, Heart of Depravity, and Darkness, and Prisoner at Gaza would be a pretty solid add then. Also, I'm open to taking any of those enhancements out of the reserve, I just threw them all in because they all work well in this deck and can be useful in certain situations. 

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Offline Xonathan

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #7 on: April 24, 2018, 11:40:19 AM »
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It would be cool to try out a defense with hyper recurrablilty like your offense.
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Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #8 on: April 24, 2018, 11:42:24 AM »
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Well the problem is there aren't really any defenses like that. maybe antediluvians, they got some pretty nice stuff this year. It's not Infinite battles, but they will recur their stuff.
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Offline Xonathan

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #9 on: April 24, 2018, 11:46:07 AM »
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Demons are pretty good about getting characters back I.e. (tartaros, rebellious spirit, wandering spirit). They also have some cards that can get back EE like twice afflicted, demon behind the idols, persistent pestering.
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Offline Crashfach2002

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #10 on: April 24, 2018, 11:46:51 AM »
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Well the problem is there aren't really any defenses like that. maybe antediluvians, they got some pretty nice stuff this year. It's not Infinite battles, but they will recur their stuff.

Several defenses with recursion.  Maybe Demons?  They have Madness, Gates of Hell, you could throw in Unknown Nation as well.

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Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #11 on: April 24, 2018, 11:48:44 AM »
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I was actually looking at making a defense based around Persistent Pestering and Pestering Spirit. Really underrated combo IMO. Those two with evil armor is just devastating.

I know most defenses have some aspects of recursion, but none are at the level of most offenses. Antediluvians and demons probably do it the best, although Philistines have some nice tools as well.
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Offline Xonathan

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #12 on: April 24, 2018, 11:50:18 AM »
+2
Scribe is really versatile too because he can even recur your good enhancements too if you don’t have ee’s to target
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Offline Josh

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #13 on: April 24, 2018, 12:47:37 PM »
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Below is my updated offense. I'm not sure what to run for the defense though, anyone have any ideas? I was thinking maybe sadducees, as they actually got some pretty good NT black enhancements in this set between Wages, Heart of Depravity, and Darkness, and Prisoner at Gaza would be a pretty solid add then. Also, I'm open to taking any of those enhancements out of the reserve, I just threw them all in because they all work well in this deck and can be useful in certain situations. 

Spoiler (hover to show)

One issue with this offense is consistency.  The Ruth cards are almost all fully negatable, and the recursion cards are not nearly as effective if you draw them early.  Abdon and the Ruth characters simply don't impact the game enough when they hit the table or enter battle.

I've played around with this offense from time to time, and that was my experience.  However, I didn't have the new tools that FoM introduced, nor did I build my offense the way you did.  It's quite possible that my extrapolations are simply wrong.

Let us know how testing goes!
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Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #14 on: April 24, 2018, 12:51:55 PM »
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One issue with this offense is consistency.  The Ruth cards are almost all fully negatable, and the recursion cards are not nearly as effective if you draw them early.  Abdon and the Ruth characters simply don't impact the game enough when they hit the table or enter battle.

I've played around with this offense from time to time, and that was my experience.  However, I didn't have the new tools that FoM introduced, nor did I build my offense the way you did.  It's quite possible that my extrapolations are simply wrong.

Let us know how testing goes!

Yeah, that was my general problem with this deck. Daughter's grief and Jephthah's daughter add some much needed power, but i'm not sure it will be enough. This will probably be a better deck for newer players to use, but it should still be fun regardless. 
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Offline Bobbert

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #15 on: April 24, 2018, 12:54:42 PM »
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One thing that I'm considering if I build this offense if WwC in reserve and Life Through Christ in main deck to grab her out. Yes, she turns off Death of Family, but if she stays in play she can just grab doms, which is worth it if you ask me.

Then again, I'm the type that throws WwC in the reserve of decks with no white and grab her with I am Gabe if needed, so take that with a grain of salt.
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Offline Red Wing

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #16 on: April 24, 2018, 12:57:19 PM »
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I can't imagine running a (mostly) white offense without Polycarp.
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Offline sepjazzwarrior

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #17 on: April 24, 2018, 01:01:04 PM »
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also you could throw in Justin martyr, and overcome.  In fact, just scrap all that ruth stuff and run martyrs/musicians.  There, that will fix it

Offline Asahel24601

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #18 on: April 24, 2018, 01:01:19 PM »
+1
I can't imagine running a (mostly) white offence without Polycarp.
I can understand no Justin/Polycarp to keep Unity, but I kinda feel like the deck should run Overcome. It's powerful enough that I can't see running a white deck without it.

Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #19 on: April 24, 2018, 01:02:08 PM »
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I can't imagine running a (mostly) white offence without Polycarp.
I can understand no Justin/Polycarp to keep Unity, but I kinda feel like the deck should run Overcome. It's powerful enough that I can't see running a white deck without it.

Ooh, that is a good point, no reason not to have that.

One thing that I'm considering if I build this offense if WwC in reserve and Life Through Christ in main deck to grab her out. Yes, she turns off Death of Family, but if she stays in play she can just grab doms, which is worth it if you ask me.

Then again, I'm the type that throws WwC in the reserve of decks with no white and grab her with I am Gabe if needed, so take that with a grain of salt.

I really like that, she'd be a nice finisher, although it'd be a dead card for most of the game otherwise...
« Last Edit: April 24, 2018, 01:04:45 PM by Ironisaac »
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Offline Ironisaac

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Re: Never ending battles!
« Reply #20 on: April 30, 2018, 02:51:39 PM »
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Update on this deck.

I was able to get a few games in this weekend, and it was a really fun deck to use. I used an orange demon defense, mixing the classic stuff with a few newer cards. It was mostly built around using the new Wages of Sin as many times as possible. I'll probably make a new post about that defense at some point.

As for the offense, it definitely has potential. The current build is a bit too disjointed between the judges and ruth stuff, but I think with one more gold enhancement in the main deck, it would probably work a bit better, as othniel was the only one who could grab the other ones out of the reserve, and I only had two others in the main deck. I may have to put in when judges governed, even though I really don't like that card that much.
I originally thought that I would use the ruth stuff a lot more than I did, but they were just really for set up. The offense really shines when you can get some of the judges stuff going. It's pretty fast, although I still need to figure out what the best cards are to grab first when I get searching cards early game. It's kind of difficult to decide, because you want the add to battle stuff early, but you can't really afford to grab it early game when you only have 2 or 3 heroes. So, TGWT may be a good add to get more heroes out, especially because it's so easy to grab your evil doms with wages. The only down side is it takes up your artifact slot, which is where you want Boaz's sandal, YWR, or Madness!  ::)   

So, some changes to make are fewer ruth cards, more judges, and another way to get heroes out.   

Edit: I swapped Abdon for Fearless Traveler, mostly because of the defense, and because I took out all the white judges stuff from the reserve for more defense.         
« Last Edit: April 30, 2018, 03:04:40 PM by Ironisaac »
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