Cactus Game Design Message Boards
Other Gaming => Video & Computer Games => Topic started by: Bryon on July 18, 2008, 01:52:22 AM
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From an Orlando Sentinel article about the ICBS:
What's new
Digital Praise, a Christian software developer, has created a guitar-controller computer game that allows people to play along with more than 50 songs from Christian bands. The computer game Guitar Praise, inspired by the best-selling video game Guitar Hero, provides song lyrics and follow-along musical "notes" on the screen. The game is scheduled to hit Christian bookstores this fall but will also be available on Amazon.com. "People just want good clean fun," Valerie Banks, a Digital Praise sales rep, said Monday at the convention center.
Sounds like I've found my son's Christmas present. :)
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Don't supose you'd be able to add all the songs they missed as an added feature though....
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Props to them for including Thousand Foot Krutch.
Songlist pls, kthxbye.
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*Crosses fingers* Skillet, Falling Up, Stellar Kart, pleeaaassseeeee!
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This brightens up my day so much.
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Is it for major consoles like the Wii or is it like that new "air guitar" game?
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It appears to be PC-only, like their Dance Praise titles.
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I just hope it doesn't stick as much as Dance Praise did. I was an avid DDR enthusist when Dance Praise came out and it was such a disappointment. I sense the same thing will happen here.
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I think Redemption is the only attempt to make a Christian version of a secular game that hasn't been cheesy.
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/agree
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Colin, I actually agree with you. But I really hope this one isn't cheesy...let us know, Bryon!
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It's not that it's cheesy, it's that they don't have the funds to make it successful. Guitar Hero has millions of dollars backing it to make sure the guitar itself and the game are of upstanding quality; Digital Praise doesn't have the kind of funds to make this game amazing. I'm not writing it off completely yet, but I don't suspect it'll be good.
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Many people consider Ark of the Covenant to be an excellent standalone version of Carcassonne, it's roughly equivalent to having the base game and the first couple expansions folded in. And scoring fields is considerably easier :p
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And I like Setters of Canaan for its quick setup and cool look. It isn't cheesy by any stretch.
As for the Dance stuff, I thought the Veggie one was OK. My kids like it. My nephews and nieces got the Dance praise one, and it seemed ok, too. Not amazing, but OK. I am not very familiar with the original DDR though, so I am not going to try to compare them.
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DDR is WAY better.
Also, notice what all 3 of the cheeseless games have in common? Hint: they're found in deserts and come in variants like the prickly pear and saguaro.
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yeah atleast dance praise was not as big of a flop as the Left Behind game for p.c (Shudders then buys all reamaining copies and buries them in the desert.)
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Man, This is great news. I've been waiting for a game like this for a long time, Lets just hope it's not a crap game. :P
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And I like Setters of Canaan for its quick setup and cool look. It isn't cheesy by any stretch.
As for the Dance stuff, I thought the Veggie one was OK. My kids like it. My nephews and nieces got the Dance praise one, and it seemed ok, too. Not amazing, but OK. I am not very familiar with the original DDR though, so I am not going to try to compare them.
Agreed, there are several games that aren't cheesy, Settlers, Ark, Victory, Redemption, etc.
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I think Redemption is the only attempt to make a Christian version of a secular game that hasn't been cheesy.
+1
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Did you really search every thread for some reason to post?
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I HOPE THEY HAVE DC TALK AND PETRA IN THERE!!!!!!!!!!!
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hey,
Here's the list found at: digitalpraise.com
Looks to me like there are a couple of old school bands in there (who out there has a whitecross cd?). You should email the company and suggest an "old school" expansion with Petra, Stryper (Rockin' the World), DC Talk, Old Newsboys, etc.
Artist Song Name
12 Stones Broken
Bride Same Ol' Sinner
Caedmons Call There You Go
Casting Crowns Lifesong
Chris Tomlin Made to Worship
Darrell Evans So Good To Me
David Crowder Band Foreverandever Etc.
Day Of Fire Reap and Sow
dc Talk Jesus Freak
Family Force 5 Love Addict
Flyleaf Perfect
Hawk Nelson The Show
Hawk Nelson Friend Like That
Inhabited Rescue Me
Israel & New Breed All Around
James Clay Franklin Park
Jared Anderson Blind Man
Jennifer Knapp Undo Me
Jeremy Camp Tonight
Jessie Daniels What I Hear
Jonah33 Father's Song
Josh Bates Perfect Day
Kutless Beyond the Surface
Kutless Hearts of the Innocent
Lincoln Brewster Spin
Nate Sallie All About You
Nevertheless The Real
Newsboys Something Beautiful
Paul Baloche Rock of Ages
Paul Baloche All The Earth Will Sing Your Praises
Petra Backsliding Blues
Pillar When Tommorrow Comes
Red Breathe Into Me
Relient K I Need You
Seventh Day Slumber Awake
Skillet The Older I Get
Skillet Rebirthing
Skillet Savior
Spoken Wind In My Sails
Spoken Falling Further
Spur 58 Sleepwalkers
Stellar Kart Procrastinating
Superchick We Live
The Crucified The Pit
This Beautiful Republic Going Under
Thousand Foot Krutch The Flame in All of Us
Thousand Foot Krutch The Art of Breaking
tobyMac I'm For You
Todd Agnew This Fragile Breath
Warren Barfield My Heart Goes Out
Whitecross Who Will You Follow
Whitecross When The Walls Tumble Down
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Man, This is great news. I've been waiting for a game like this for a long time, Lets just hope it's not a crap game. :P
yeah,let's hope it's AWESOME just as close as u can get! i hope it's not a piece of crap either because i won't buy a Guitar Hero game.
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Well honestly the system for GH is pure awesome, so hopfully it will either work like GH or have an awesome revolutionary system.
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i'm hoping it's BETTER than Guitar Hero. (i've played it at my cosins and i'm ashamed to say,but it was really fun)
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I still don't get why you are ashamed. 95% of the songs are below "offensive".
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Yeah, the singer from Whitecross taught me guitar.
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hey,
Here's the list found at: digitalpraise.com
Looks to me like there are a couple of old school bands in there (who out there has a whitecross cd?). You should email the company and suggest an "old school" expansion with Petra, Stryper (Rockin' the World), DC Talk, Old Newsboys, etc.
Artist Song Name
12 Stones Broken
Bride Same Ol' Sinner
Caedmons Call There You Go
Casting Crowns Lifesong
Chris Tomlin Made to Worship
Darrell Evans So Good To Me
David Crowder Band Foreverandever Etc.
Day Of Fire Reap and Sow
dc Talk Jesus Freak
Family Force 5 Love Addict
Flyleaf Perfect
Hawk Nelson The Show
Hawk Nelson Friend Like That
Inhabited Rescue Me
Israel & New Breed All Around
James Clay Franklin Park
Jared Anderson Blind Man
Jennifer Knapp Undo Me
Jeremy Camp Tonight
Jessie Daniels What I Hear
Jonah33 Father's Song
Josh Bates Perfect Day
Kutless Beyond the Surface
Kutless Hearts of the Innocent
Lincoln Brewster Spin
Nate Sallie All About You
Nevertheless The Real
Newsboys Something Beautiful
Paul Baloche Rock of Ages
Paul Baloche All The Earth Will Sing Your Praises
Petra Backsliding Blues
Pillar When Tommorrow Comes
Red Breathe Into Me
Relient K I Need You
Seventh Day Slumber Awake
Skillet The Older I Get
Skillet Rebirthing
Skillet Savior
Spoken Wind In My Sails
Spoken Falling Further
Spur 58 Sleepwalkers
Stellar Kart Procrastinating
Superchick We Live
The Crucified The Pit
This Beautiful Republic Going Under
Thousand Foot Krutch The Flame in All of Us
Thousand Foot Krutch The Art of Breaking
tobyMac I'm For You
Todd Agnew This Fragile Breath
Warren Barfield My Heart Goes Out
Whitecross Who Will You Follow
Whitecross When The Walls Tumble Down
i have a older cd of the Newsboys. it's the one where it has an older car on the case. love almost all the songs on it.
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they still need WAY MORE songs on it. like:
jars of clay-dead man
some other old newsboys songs
and ahole lot more.
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Agreed, many songs we would like to see on there are not there. :( no FIF.
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WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :'( :'(
not all songs r on!
WAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAA!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :'( :'(
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I must say, I'm dissapointed with the TFK choices. Flame in all of Us was good, but why Art of Breaking?
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Uhm.... where is Stryper?
Also... they coulda looked for some obscure stuff with you know, COMPLEX guitar sections.
A little stuff like Theocracy would be awesome on there: http://www.theocracymusic.com/mp3/OnEaglesWings.mp3
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Yeah....I know :( bets they don't let you upload your own songs (which would "redeem" this product)
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no but they are making expantion packs
P.S this game is load of fun ;D
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no but they are making expantion packs
P.S this game is load of fun ;D
PRAISE THE LORD!
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no but they are making expantion packs
P.S this game is load of fun ;D
PRAISE THE LORD!
me and my best friend just finished hard mode
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I have a question about the game. Do you unlock songs as you go? Or do they just throw all the songs to you at once?
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I have a question about the game. Do you unlock songs as you go? Or do they just throw all the songs to you at once?
You unlock songs in sets of five
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So it works basically like GH?
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cf9-BhcTHgc (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cf9-BhcTHgc)
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I am going to keep all my non edifying comments in my head and only say...wow.
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I have to say it looks like it works but doesnt look too pretty and it seems like it would be hard to play with triangles....
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...wow. pass.
rock band and gh are the only ways to go.
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it looks pretty decent, i'll probably wind up getting it
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I don't like the trigles thing, but it seems decent. I like how they have the lyrics at the top, but I think that should be an optional feature... maybe it is.
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Lol, I'll say it again, the game can PLAY super great, but this kinda game is worthless without tracks that... you know, solos?
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GHWT, Download your own tracks. I'm sure they could have put Underoath or P.O.D. in the game, Maybe they'll come out with a hard rock expansion.
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That game lacked anything that would make me want to buy it instead of, in addition to, or in spite of Guitar Hero. Heck, it even makes Rock Band look good.
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I despise that cut to rock band I like rock band why...I like drums ;D but this game was the worst lame christian secular playoff so far
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Christian gaming rips off secular gaming with a lesser quality product! We never saw it coming!
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Christian gaming rips off secular gaming with a lesser quality product! We never saw it coming!
win.
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one of Lincoln Brewster's songs are on there. Lincoln Brewster was the guitarist for Journey before he became a Christian. he's pretty good
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they need WAY MORE features on the game like:
story mode (like GH)
a stage to play on (like GH)
a player to represent u on the game (like GH)
more giutars (like GH)
more songs
unlockable costums and other unlockables (like GH)
i can go on and on of what they need.i WILL NOT buy it for $100!maybe $50 or $25.
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and downloadable/custom songs. Seeing a Metal Gear remix played on GH is one of the most awesome things I've seen in a while.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ7wqZHSWqk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ7wqZHSWqk)
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they need WAY MORE features on the game like:
story mode (like GH)
a stage to play on (like GH)
a player to represent u on the game (like GH)
more giutars (like GH)
more songs
unlockable costums and other unlockables (like GH)
i can go on and on of what they need.i WILL NOT buy it for $100!maybe $50 or $25.
So, buy GH, customize it to add christian songs, and TAAADDAAA. Though that does take technical knowledge. You could just buy GH, play GH, and enjoy GH, and hopfuly show most christian gaming companies we don't want cheap knock offers, we want quality.
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A clever entrepreneur would gather up some licenses for some of the better material available, package up some custom GH tracks for those songs and sell em for whatever amounts to 10 bucks on XBLA.
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and downloadable/custom songs. Seeing a Metal Gear remix played on GH is one of the most awesome things I've seen in a while.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ7wqZHSWqk (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vJ7wqZHSWqk)
This song makes me want to plug my controller into controller port 2.
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That song is amazing Schaef...
However, I still love this one:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EndLVHRWhrE (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EndLVHRWhrE)
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i googled the GP and i saw more on there than what they addvertised,my dad googled it too and said that can be my Christmas present.i don't know y he told me. ??? ???
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i googled the GP and i saw more on there than what they addvertised,my dad googled it too and said that can be my Christmas present.i don't know y he told me. ??? ???
Maybe so you wouldn't keep asking him for it for the next 2.5 months?
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no,i don't bother them for stuff,usally they let me get stuff because i always repay them back.but i think he told me because he must have figered i knew thats what they were getting me for Christmas.i'm going to see if i get it way earliier though. ;D :D ;)
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Switchfoot. 'Nuff said.
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*Crosses fingers* Skillet, Falling Up, Stellar Kart, pleeaaassseeeee!
they have a few skillet like rebirthing and older i get
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i mean,it makes me want to go up to them and tell them they need to make it like GH,just christain lyrics and background. unless i get it,I'M NOT BUYING THIS!!
[modbreak=Justin]Inappropriate line removed. There are more appropriate ways to express your dislike of whatever game or games it is that you don't like. Feel free to restate your opinion in a more respectful manner.[/modbreak]
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A surprisingly negative comment since this a Christian game forum.
I enjoy Christian "stuff" more than secular because of the theme/lyrics/mood/morals/overall Bible focus that should be in every Christian's priority list. IMO, a disdain for Christian "stuff" usually means that your priorities are out of place.
FWIW, I do not necessarily support the purchase of this particular game since this type of platform is not appealing to me.
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Dude, I can't believe you said that on a Redemption forum.... because Redemption is, ya know, a CHRISTIAN CARD GAME?
I agree with YMT. I at least like to try Christian-themed stuff before I make a judgment. I feel blessed that we have Redemption and other quality board/card games from Cactus and other providers who want to glorify Christ in everything.
~Marti
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Although +1 with Marti and YMT, I understand I think what dudester is trying to say.
"Christian" games are often not as fun as a secular (not even bad/wrong) games. Redemption IMO is a big exception as I have yet to find a TCG better. Guitar Praise will probably not be anywhere as good (game mechanics) as Guatar Hero or Rock Band. However, it is a personal opinion if having the Christian focus makes up for the lesser quality of the game itself.
Cameron
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Dudester Fails.
dude, you need to start using your head and think before you post
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unless i get it,I'M NOT BUYING THIS!!
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fimg.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fv104%2Fphapster%2Flol-wut.jpg&hash=6ad7f9fe281dff75b70453d5bb1c9ffd41f92578)
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However, it is a personal opinion if having the Christian focus makes up for the lesser quality of the game itself.
This is very insightful and ideally the point I would support. The general approach that people seem to take is that because a game/band/movie is Christian that the quality is automatically lower. I disagree with that notion. The people/technology/resources tend to be a greater influence on quality. I would still rather support a lower quality Christian effort than a high quality secular effort. Someday maybe the Christian effort will be the higher quality, but that trend is still moving slowly, albeit better than say the 1980's.
We also have to be willing to accept that perception changes from the inside. I still find 1990's Christian rock music to be better than the secular mainstream of that time period. I was heavily into the secular bands before I became a Christian and got involved in the Christian bands, so I speak from experience on both sides.
With regard to Redemption, I think we (as gamers) are fortunate that someone as gifted as Rob was the one that started this campaign. Having equally intelligent and creative contributors along the way has kept Redemption ahead of the secular curve. I have not been around long enough to know all of the founding fathers of Redemption, but I know that people like Rob, Doug Gray, Chris Bany, Mike Berkenpas, Eric Largent, Bryon Hake, Schaef, Gabe, Ben and the other Ben, Fortress Alstad, both Professors, Tim Mierz....., Roy, Polarius, people with only initials or numbers for names, et al have kept the game growing and challenging. These are extraordinary people, not your average Joes.
Hopefully other Christian media will tap into the gifted Christians that this community has, so that someday Christian "stuff" will be our first choice in everything.
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The general approach that people seem to take is that because a game/band/movie is Christian that the quality is automatically lower.
I agree with your point that this feeling is automatic, but I don't think it is without some merit. A lot of games that are Christian are lower quality sometimes. As I said in my post before, I pointed out Redemption was a huge exception. If you look at something even like Victory at Hebron and compare that to another RPG like KOTOR, there is a huge difference in quality. (I realize the 2 games are different, but it is just an analogy.)
I would still rather support a lower quality Christian effort than a high quality secular effort.
I would too, but I still want Rock Band with Christian music, not a rock band like christian game. The enjoyment is just different.
We also have to be willing to accept that perception changes from the inside. I still find 1990's Christian rock music to be better than the secular mainstream of that time period. I was heavily into the secular bands before I became a Christian and got involved in the Christian bands, so I speak from experience on both sides.
I find this point very interesting. I personally do not listen to anything in music non-christian. Many might argue, like you said, that secular music is technically better quality that christian music. That I don't argue, but IMO, this is a small point for me and music. So, I actually am on both sides of the fence.
With regard to Redemption, I think we (as gamers) are fortunate that someone as gifted as Rob was the one that started this campaign. Having equally intelligent and creative contributors along the way has kept Redemption ahead of the secular curve. I have not been around long enough to know all of the founding fathers of Redemption, but I know that people like Rob, Doug Gray, Chris Bany, Mike Berkenpas, Eric Largent, Bryon Hake, Schaef, Gabe, Ben and the other Ben, Fortress Alstad, both Professors, Tim Mierz....., Roy, Polarius, people with only letters or numbers for names, et al have kept the game growing and challenging. These are extraordinary people, not your average Joes.
+1 +1 Totally agree with you.
Hopefully other Christian media will tap into the gifted Christians that this community has, so that someday Christian "stuff" will be our first choice in everything.
I hope for that too. However, does everything need to be christian based? (PLEASE note: I am not saying everything doesn't need to be appropriate/"christian". There is a difference between a christian game and a appropriate game that does not interfere with christian beliefs.) Take my earlier example of KOTOR. That game was pretty "christian" and didn't have much/any wrong with it (IMO). However, I really don't want to play a christian version of KOTOR where the player becomes a christian and you can't be a Sith *cry*. Sometimes, I want to play a RPG or a game that does not end with the gospel message at the end. (Not saying it isn't needed, but I just want video games to be alternate dimension a little bit).
So, in conclusion, I wish for a world where everything is "christian". I also want a new MacBook Pro right now, so if that could be added to my utopia that would be great.
Cameron
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Dudester Fails.
dude, you need to start using your head and think before you post
Andy,
The post may or may not have been meant that way, but regardless, everyone has their own opinions.
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sorry guys,i didn't mean to sound all "worldly".i know i said "stinks" and sorry about that.
but,i mean,seriously,christain game producers need to make their "christain" games fun and addicting.
sorry again. :'( :-[ :-\ :-X
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I have come into this thread without reading all that has been said, but I think I get the idea of the arguments which are presented. I would like to point out two things which might seem obvious, but they are nonetheless important:
1. In a secular world, sin sells. The sad truth is that the gaming and entertainment industries are geared towards a majority of people who are seeking a sinful escape to real life, one for which they will not be held accountable. For this, the Christian entertainment field is lacking in popularity.
2. Along similar lines, Christian entertainment lacks a major financial driving force and incentive to produce products that people would actually buy on a large scale. Hence, we are sad to note the comparatively poor quality of Christian entertainment.
The above facts are sad, but it is the result of Christians abandoning their own entertainment industry in favor of what the world has to offer.
:2cents:
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However, does everything need to be christian based? (PLEASE note: I am not saying everything doesn't need to be appropriate/"christian". There is a difference between a christian game and a appropriate game that does not interfere with christian beliefs.) Take my earlier example of KOTOR. That game was pretty "christian" and didn't have much/any wrong with it (IMO). However, I really don't want to play a christian version of KOTOR where the player becomes a christian and you can't be a Sith *cry*. Sometimes, I want to play a RPG or a game that does not end with the gospel message at the end. (Not saying it isn't needed, but I just want video games to be alternate dimension a little bit).
My vision would be that you would not be as interested in being a Knight from the Old Republic when you can be one of David's Mighty Men (coming soon to a Gamestop near you). ;D
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lol,nice
just better be good!!
lol
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Exactly.
My problem is that "Christian" products tend to be more expensive and less fun than their secular counterparts. Slapping Jesus' face on an energy drink doesn't merit me paying twice as much for it. Taking Altoids minus the flavor, and changing the name to "Testamints" is not something good for the flock. What do we offer the world? Crappy knock-offs that we're expected to enjoy because they've got Jesus on them? With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
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Exactly.
My problem is that "Christian" products tend to be more expensive and less fun than their secular counterparts. Slapping Jesus' face on an energy drink doesn't merit me paying twice as much for it. Taking Altoids minus the flavor, and changing the name to "Testamints" is not something good for the flock. What do we offer the world? Crappy knock-offs that we're expected to enjoy because they've got Jesus on them? With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
:laugh: lol that's pretty gold there, pol about the spaghetti thing
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Exactly.
My problem is that "Christian" products tend to be more expensive and less fun than their secular counterparts. Slapping Jesus' face on an energy drink doesn't merit me paying twice as much for it. Taking Altoids minus the flavor, and changing the name to "Testamints" is not something good for the flock. What do we offer the world? Crappy knock-offs that we're expected to enjoy because they've got Jesus on them? With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
+1. I personally don't think I will ever perfer "David's Mighty Men" to KOTOR (using YMT's example). Sometimes, I just want something without a christian base.
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Exactly.
My problem is that "Christian" products tend to be more expensive and less fun than their secular counterparts. Slapping Jesus' face on an energy drink doesn't merit me paying twice as much for it. Taking Altoids minus the flavor, and changing the name to "Testamints" is not something good for the flock. What do we offer the world? Crappy knock-offs that we're expected to enjoy because they've got Jesus on them? With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
+1
Look at redemption it started of horrible (lim/prophets) and not that fun but rob learned while making it from his mistakes and improved it. Seemingly we don't learn from our mistakes in the "Christian" industry. There are exceptions over all but mostly they just keep popping out the same old stuff. A rip off of DDR, A rip off of monopoly, etc. not only is the quality lacking... the originality is lacking too!
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With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
Gee. I didn't realize that I was responsible for turning so many people away from God. I guess God is very angry with me. Luckily there are people like you who can draw so many people toward God to make up for my losses.
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I lol'd. Your sarcasm lacks reasoning.
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I lol'd. Your sarcasm lacks reasoning.
Well naturally. That is why I am a complete failure as a Christian.
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It was funny the first time. Now I'm just bored.
In case you care about rational discussion, I'm going to point out that you're not the offender in my rant. Sure attitudes like yours don't help, but the problem is "Cristian" manufacturing companies who skimp on quality and originality and jack up the price. If a Buddhist came up to me and said, "hey, come be a Buddhist! We all love each other and listen to B music and watch B movies because they're made for Buddhists," I wouldn't even give it a second though.
And even then it's a subset of the bigger problem: Christianity has nothing to offer. Our music, movies, games, candy (somehow more Christian than Hershey's?), and universities are generally of lower quality. We don't act any different from the world. People who claim Christ get on TV and trick people into giving them money or thinking that they are healing people. We're even more divorced than secular people. Heck, even I look at Christianity and say "yuck!" Luckily for me I know Jesus and I know that the yuck has nothing to do with him, but not everyone has that advantage. We're low-quality-ing people into hell.
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It was funny the first time. Now I'm just bored.
In case you care about rational discussion, I'm going to point out that you're not the offender in my rant. Sure attitudes like yours don't help, but the problem is "Cristian" manufacturing companies who skimp on quality and originality and jack up the price. If a Buddhist came up to me and said, "hey, come be a Buddhist! We all love each other and listen to B music and watch B movies because they're made for Buddhists," I wouldn't even give it a second though.
And even then it's a subset of the bigger problem: Christianity has nothing to offer. Our music, movies, games, candy (somehow more Christian than Hershey's?), and universities are generally of lower quality. We don't act any different from the world. People who claim Christ get on TV and trick people into giving them money or thinking that they are healing people. We're even more divorced than secular people. Heck, even I look at Christianity and say "yuck!" Luckily for me I know Jesus and I know that the yuck has nothing to do with him, but not everyone has that advantage. We're low-quality-ing people into hell.
+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1
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Your opinion is noted, however the quote from an earlier post...
With a large number of people holding your viewpoint, YMT, combined with the fact that Christians don't know why they believe what they believe and therefore don't follow it, is why so many people look at Christians today and say "YUCK! no thanks, I'll be agnostic/new age/church of the flying spaghetti monster/whatever."
...does not say that. You singled out my opinion and attached it to a conclusion that people like me drive people away from God. There is no other interpretation of the quote. I'm not sure how that is anything other than a personal attack. You have no knowledge of me or of my effect on unbelievers. Any impact my life has had to further God's Kingdom is irrelevant to you because of my opinion about Christian media. Beyond that, however, you have concluded that any effect I may have had would have to be negative. Your clairvoyance astounds me.
You can hold whatever opinion you want. But when you make statements like the one I quoted above, you bring the judgment of a Holy God upon yourself. You will be judged by the same measure.
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Your leaps in logic are baffling. It's a good thing you're a math teacher and not a English/Philosophy/Logic/insert liberal art here professor.
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It's a good thing you're a math teacher and not a English/Philosophy/Logic/insert liberal art here professor.
Indeed.
Since your continued personal attacks are what I see as driving people away from God, you are now guilty by the measure which you judged me by.
Time to pray.
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Time to humble.
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And even then it's a subset of the bigger problem: Christianity has nothing to offer.
That's a pretty bold statement....
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Time to humble.
Exactly. We both need to pray for each other to accomplish God's Will.
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To try to get this discussion back on topic, and off individuals...
It seems like the two sides being presented are basically this:
1 - Christians should judge quality (of music, movies, games, etc.) through the perspective of God (message aligning with His will, bringing Him glory, etc.), instead of through the perspective of man (technical skill in acting, instrument playing, game mechanics, etc.)
2 - Having the above perspective leads to "Christian" translating to "2nd rate" in the eyes of the world and this turns people away from Christianity.
I think that the obvious problem with perspective #2 is that while people may not be drawn to Christianity because we have the best movies, music, and games, that those things shouldn't be what draws people to Christianity anyway. I didn't become a Christian because of their entertainment. I became a Christian because the Holy Spirit worked in my heart and helped me to see who God was in the universe that He created, and because I came to believe in the Word of God.
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God came to give us life and life more abundantly, not a second-rate life. Why can't Christians be the best? We have truth, we are best able to understand beauty, and aught to be well equipped to show goodness. So why do we settle for mediocrity?
Note: When I said Christianity has nothing to offer, I mean it appears to have nothing to offer to the world.
Also, this is a video game forum so we're arguing about entertainment, but to your "I didn't become a Christian to be entertained" business, I answer that the trash in the entertainment market stems from the same root that puts trash in Christian arts. Music, paintings, architecture, these aren't just entertainment at all! The fine arts are essential to life. Christians aught to believe in life abundantly in more ways than taping up their mouths to protest abortion.
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Yes God wants us to have abundant life. But that doesn't necessarily mean that we will be able to sing better harmony than a non-Christian.
I agree with you that as Christians we should try to make the best music, movies, and games that we can. However, I disagree that someone who was going to become a Christian, changes their mind and decides not to because the movie "Left Behind" seems lame.
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God came to give us life and life more abundantly, not a second-rate life.
My prayer is that someday you will see that the more abundant joy comes from building people up rather than tearing them down.
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1 - Christians should judge quality (of music, movies, games, etc.) through the perspective of God (message aligning with His will, bringing Him glory, etc.), instead of through the perspective of man (technical skill in acting, instrument playing, game mechanics, etc.)
2 - Having the above perspective leads to "Christian" translating to "2nd rate" in the eyes of the world and this turns people away from Christianity.
While I agree with #2, I DO NOT agree that having Christian stuff turns people away from God. I just said that I don't enjoy it as much speaking only on an entertainment level.
God came to give us life and life more abundantly, not a second-rate life.
My prayer is that someday you will see that the more abundant joy comes from building people up rather than tearing them down.
Come on YMT.... WE were trying to get this discussion off of individuals.
To try to get this discussion back on topic, and off individuals...
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God came to give us life and life more abundantly, not a second-rate life.
My prayer is that someday you will see that the more abundant joy comes from building people up rather than tearing them down.
The Irony that this is tearing him down by saying he is wrong is not lost on me. Now would you two stop? Both of you hold an equally valid view.
How can we witness to other gamers by showing them half way done games? We can't. Sure it may not win 99% of souls to have a well done game but if it saves 1...isn't it worth it?
YMT does have a point christian content (Not quality) is better for anything, be it game or book.
Now PLEASE stop. You both are talking about bringing people to God and looking different from the world and you BOTH are tearing each other down. Be it meant that way or not it is happening. Please stop.
Anyways back on topic...
I say #2 CAN turn people away from God. If we won't even put enough effort into making a good game (That is supposed to support and show support for our God) why would we put effort into worshiping him?
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God came to give us life and life more abundantly, not a second-rate life.
My prayer is that someday you will see that the more abundant joy comes from building people up rather than tearing them down.
The Irony that this is tearing him down by saying he is wrong is not lost on me. Now would you two stop? Both of you hold an equally valid view.
How can we witness to other gamers by showing them half way done games? We can't. Sure it may not win 99% of souls to have a well done game but if it saves 1...isn't it worth it?
YMT does have a point christian content (Not quality) is better for anything, be it game or book.
Now PLEASE stop. You both are talking about bringing people to God and looking different from the world and you BOTH are tearing each other down. Be it meant that way or not it is happening. Please stop.
Anyways back on topic...
I say #2 CAN turn people away from God. If we won't even put enough effort into making a good game (That is supposed to support and show support for our God) why would we put effort into worshiping him?
+1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 +1 :amen: :amen: :amen: :amen:
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By some of your definitions of "good" movies and games (those that hold Prof's viewpoint #2), I don't think Christians will ever compete.
Look at one of the top movies, even "voted" by on this board: The Dark Knight
It is a very dark and violent movie that had some disturbing themes. Christian writers and directors aren't going to make a movie like that. So in that respect, Christians are going to compete against an "A" movie like Batman.
Look at some of the top selling games: Halo, Brawl, KOTOR
All of them are violent oriented. (Guitar Hero has more sexual theme in my mind.) Again, I believe that Christian games will ever compete because a Christian designer will not make a game of that central theme. Game quality can be overlooked depending on the theme.
Unfortunately, in movies and games, the two top sellers (which "coincidentally" are not Christian) are sex and violence. Coming from these themes, Christian productS will NEVER compete.
The only reason I haven't bought Guitar Praise yet is because it was made for computer. That was the fact that turned me off. My laptop screen is too small to play effectively when I'm used to playing to a much larger television screen. Bummer too because it looks awesome.
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By some of your definitions of "good" movies and games (those that hold Prof's viewpoint #2)...
Just to clarify, lest anyone be confused. Prof doesn't hold to "Prof's viewpoint #2" :)
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Maybe I should have quoted it instead of labeling it. I thought it was an understood (Prof #1 and Prof #2)...didn't mean to misrepresent by saying that you held to one over the other.
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Though violence wouldn't be the central theme it still can be included. Alot of people get so uppity about games with violence in them sometimes, yet are completely ok with reading the O.T.
Honestly I think finding a game that appeals to both parties would be awesome.
Like an RTS of OT battles, God laid alot of behind kicking in those, which showed his power, yet would still have enough action to be awesome.
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The Irony that this is tearing him down by saying he is wrong is not lost on me.
I'm not sure at what point "iron sharpens iron" became such a heinous act among Christians, but I was being sincere rather than sarcastic. Is praying for my brother in Christ really considered "tearing him down?" Somehow my words are not being taken literally here. I made a couple of exaggerated posts earlier to prove a point, but how exactly have I "torn him down?" Am I the only one who sees his remarks as a negative attack on a fellow believer? Any sarcasm I used was directed at myself, not him.
If my prayer is seen as sarcasm, then I have indeed been misinterpreted. Frankly, I have chosen to pray because I see so much of myself, when I was his age, in him. It was the "effective prayer of righteous people" that helped me change the way I talk to people. I certainly have more work to do, but I'm not nearly the person I used to be. I think that Polarius can make all of his points without the negativity, which may just be more habit than anything else (at least it was for me).
I am not trying to compare myself (or my old self) to him, but rather show that I empathize with the struggle to not be negative. I want to help, but it seems that I have failed in that regard.
Now PLEASE stop. You both are talking about bringing people to God and looking different from the world and you BOTH are tearing each other down. Be it meant that way or not it is happening. Please stop.
I apologize for the misperception that I have given. I apologize to Polarius if that was the way I was coming across. I was trying to point out that you did not need to pinpoint me in trying to prove your point about Christian media. Nothing more. I will not post on this thread anymore.
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I think an RTS based on the old testament would be awesome
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I disagree strongly with whomever it was that said Christian writers would never do something like The Dark Knight. Actually, I completely agree, but filmmakers who follow Jesus would. There is real evil in the world, and the Christianese thing to do is gloss over it. That's why we have nothing to say when tragedy strikes or when someone does something very wrong. Writing movies from a Biblical viewpoint would include violence and other themes that aren't "nice." The difference isn't the subject matter, it's the treatment of the subject matter. The world makes profane movies, but followers of Jesus can make movies with obscene content.
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From an Orlando Sentinel article about the ICBS:
What's new
Digital Praise, a Christian software developer, has created a guitar-controller computer game that allows people to play along with more than 50 songs from Christian bands. The computer game Guitar Praise, inspired by the best-selling video game Guitar Hero, provides song lyrics and follow-along musical "notes" on the screen. The game is scheduled to hit Christian bookstores this fall but will also be available on Amazon.com. "People just want good clean fun," Valerie Banks, a Digital Praise sales rep, said Monday at the convention center.
Sounds like I've found my son's Christmas present. :)
I would buy that for sure if it was for 360. I like the concept of of Guitar Hero but the images and songs bother me this howver hope- fully would combine guitar hero aspects with good wholesome songs.
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I disagree strongly with whomever it was that said Christian writers would never do something like The Dark Knight. Actually, I completely agree, but filmmakers who follow Jesus would. There is real evil in the world, and the Christianese thing to do is gloss over it. That's why we have nothing to say when tragedy strikes or when someone does something very wrong. Writing movies from a Biblical viewpoint would include violence and other themes that aren't "nice." The difference isn't the subject matter, it's the treatment of the subject matter. The world makes profane movies, but followers of Jesus can make movies with obscene content.
Whoo boy...I have tried to keep out of this one, but I think we have finally hit an interesting talking point...Let us use House as a current example...a fantastic book and the movie doesn't look to be too terrible either. But the powers that be put an R rating on it and now people are concerned about Christians not seeing it. That I have a problem with. I am curious why every piece of work that we want to connect with Christianity has to be family friendly? What happened to thought-provoking and provocative? The "world" has some things that are not safe for kids to understand, and yet some people are surprised when I point out the same things in the Bible, why? Because children are innocent and naive, and they are supposed to be that way. Until you can mentally understand certain concepts should you be exposed to them. However I tread very lightly on this topic, because the essence here is intent and meaning as well as being concerned for your fellow brother or sister. If Paul was telling the Greeks to lay off the "impure" meat when in the presence of Jewish family, are we to be any different? Even if no harm was intended? Just what is acceptable as obscene anyway? Is there a supposed to be a difference in the lives we see on the big screen and what is in reality happening around us?
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1) I do not deny the violence and sex in the Bible. Several of the stories would make really good movies. What I'm saying is....I don't think it's going to get made because many Christians (not title only) shy away from violent acts and the portrayals of them: real or not. I thought the best scene in the Dark Knight had ZERO violence: it was when both boats chose not to blow the other up out of respect for human life.
I would buy that for sure if it was for 360. I like the concept of of Guitar Hero but the images and songs bother me this howver hope- fully would combine guitar hero aspects with good wholesome songs.
2) I want to echo Hobbit's comments on the images and songs on Guitar Hero. I wish Guitar Praise was on a console. I would have bought one the first day out.
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I want to echo Hobbit's comments on the images and songs on Guitar Hero. I wish Guitar Praise was on a console. I would have bought one the first day out.
Same here. I really want it on the Wii, not the computer
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yea,me too