Cactus Game Design Message Boards
Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Redemption® Resources and Thinktank => Strategies and Combos => Topic started by: Josh on August 13, 2011, 10:53:04 AM
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Fact: Red will be a popular offense now.
Fact: Red has 3 legit battlewinners that will usually be CBN against Philistines (who have no CBN banding), all of which can be recurred with A Soldier's Prayer.
Fact: Red can attack with Asahel, choose Goliath to block, Asahel doesn't get kicked out of battle (protected), add Ahimelek to battle, return Goliath, CBN with David in play. If you don't negate Asahel with Golden Calf/Covenant with Death/etc or you don't CM one of those three heroes before the attack, Red will win this battle all day. Oh, and Ahimelek protects WC heroes from capture.
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Maybe not shelved, but I don't expect Philistines to be competitive.
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Goliath is too good to be shelved, but the amount of play he sees will probably be based on the popularity of red.
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Goliath is too good to be shelved, but the amount of play he sees will probably be based on the popularity of red.
Red won't be popular in Type 1, or at least, it shouldn't be.
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Why shouldn't it be?
It's awesome!
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What's so special about it in T1 other than CBN against philistines.
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Ahimilek
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Ahimilek
Hard to do in Type 1
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Not with the deck I built.
Among other things there's Ambush, Silver trumpets, and King Amazing. thats at least 4 times right there, plus I could get Ambush back with Soldiers prayer, so that'd be five.
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Heck I can do seven at least.
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You can do TONS more than seven, but those are among the easiest.
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Not with the deck I built.
Among other things there's Ambush, Silver trumpets, and King Amazing. thats at least 4 times right there, plus I could get Ambush back with Soldiers prayer, so that'd be five.
Ambush has to be the first thing you do, so that makes that harder.
Silver Trumpets requires a priest and it ties up your art slot. That makes that harder.
King Amazing requires you to also be playing with Jehoash and have them both. That makes that harder.
Using Ambush again would require you to kill Ahimelek, then recur him to hand, then play Ambush. That's ridiculous to hope for consistantly.
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Well, with my deck it helps that I play Red, Purple, Teal, and Brown... actually, I'm starting to see your point...
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Well, with my deck it helps that I play Red, Purple, Teal, and Brown... actually, I'm starting to see your point...
And the fact that you need to do that to use him effectively translates to him not being that good in T1.
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Yeah... Darn it! Why can I never win any debates with red brigade,
I lose if people says it's weak, if they say it's OP, and if they say it just won't be all that popular in T1!
Not Fair >:(
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Ahimelek is great as a sub strat, you just cant build your deck around him and expect to compete top tier.
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True, I guess I don't build my whole deck around him. Probably around half of it does though... which could bite me in the buckler, I guess...
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Ahimelek is like TGT was. The offense is already good without it, but add it and it becomes lunacy.
Furthermore, don't Ambush Ahimelek. Ambush one of the 9001 guys that bands to him.
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Ahimelek is like TGT was. The offense is already good without it, but add it and it becomes lunacy.
Furthermore, don't Ambush Ahimelek. Ambush one of the 9001 guys that bands to him.
Wut? I assume you mean FBTNB, but still, that's a bit of a stretch.
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No, I mean TGT. In its hayday, a TGT offense would still have been top tier without TGT. Add a single card and it becomes incredibly powerful.
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No, I mean TGT. In its hayday, a TGT offense would still have been top tier without TGT. Add a single card and it becomes incredibly powerful.
Right, I was refering to the comments about Ahimelek.
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Furthermore, don't Ambush Ahimelek. Ambush one of the 9001 guys that bands to him.
Good Point, but actually there aren't that many who can band with Ahimilek, mostly 'cuz he's from 1 Samuel;
there's only like seven-ish, I think.
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Samuel, Abishai, Joab?, and Israelite Archer can do it.
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Samuel, Abishai, Joab?, and Israelite Archer can do it.
Don't forget Asahel and Ishmaiah the Gibeonite can band to any O.T. red warrior class, so both of them can band to Ahimelek as well as many other red cards.
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Ahimelek is like TGT was. The offense is already good without it, but add it and it becomes lunacy.
Furthermore, don't Ambush Ahimelek. Ambush one of the 9001 guys that bands to him.
And what if they block with a character that negates banding or a FBTN EC? Wouldn't it be better to just ambush the character that will work guaranteed (if they don't band)?
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Orange gets a huge boost after MN nats, lolz.
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ahimelek is the best to ambush first. but once hes down, ambush works for him no longer, so you might as well ambush the banders.
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I think that making something to degrade phillistines was a good idea.
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Blocking BTN would Negate Ahimelek anyway, so that's a wash. As for negating banding, that's 12FG and if you can't kill him with Red you fail.
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David isn't in play?
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Blocking BTN would Negate Ahimelek anyway, so that's a wash. As for negating banding, that's 12FG and if you can't kill him with Red you fail.
You can also prevent banding with Herod the Great, as well as the 4 FBTN ECs.
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Samuel, Abishai, Joab?, and Israelite Archer can do it.
Don't forget Asahel and Ishmaiah the Gibeonite can band to any O.T. red warrior class, so both of them can band to Ahimelek as well as many other red cards.
ArmorBearer makes seven
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I think red is quite good and I honestly see it being top tier with either purple or teal. But It think the top will be teal/green. I mean, there are now 4 heroes I believe that are both green and teal? So almost half of your heroes can play all your enhancements.
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I think red is quite good and I honestly see it being top tier with either purple or teal. But It think the top will be teal/green. I mean, there are now 4 heroes I believe that are both green and teal? So almost half of your heroes can play all your enhancements.
...Or you could play Red or Genesis, then all your heroes can play all your enhancements and half of them will be CBN.
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Green/Gold/Silver will be the first thing I experiment with. Red with brown defense will be the second thing.
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Did anyone get XXV in Booster Draft, If so how did it play??
DARiO
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I got xxv in booster and did so-so with it. However, I was unable to draft any banding cards at all except Sound the Trumpet (or whatever that red Prophets one is), so I didn't expect to do well from the start.
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I got Tin XXV and got to the top table where I lost due to a bad draw (I didn't get heroes on the first turn) I ended up getting 7th, and
although I also drafted Abishai and King Jehosaphat (Ki). The deck was good.
I believe First and Second used the Judges tin.
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I got Tin XXV and got to the top table where I lost due to a bad draw (I didn't get heroes on the first turn) I ended up getting 7th, and
although I also drafted Abishai and King Jehosaphat (Ki). The deck was good.
I believe First and Second used the Judges tin.
First place used the Royalty tin. Second had the Judges. Both decks can be found in the Complete Decks section.
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I got Tin XXV and got to the top table where I lost due to a bad draw (I didn't get heroes on the first turn) I ended up getting 7th, and
although I also drafted Abishai and King Jehosaphat (Ki). The deck was good.
I believe First and Second used the Judges tin.
First place used the Royalty tin. Second had the Judges. Both decks can be found in the Complete Decks section.
I couldn't remember, I knew that there were 2 Judges decks at the top table (although even that is a little sketchy) and I couldn't remember who had it. Although it may not have been a fair test because some tins were distributed more than others due to similar brigades at the same table (although I'm not sure which ones)
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I got Tin XXV and got to the top table where I lost due to a bad draw (I didn't get heroes on the first turn) I ended up getting 7th, and
although I also drafted Abishai and King Jehosaphat (Ki). The deck was good.
I believe First and Second used the Judges tin.
First place used the Royalty tin. Second had the Judges. Both decks can be found in the Complete Decks section.
I couldn't remember, I knew that there were 2 Judges decks at the top table (although even that is a little sketchy) and I couldn't remember who had it. Although it may not have been a fair test because some tins were distributed more than others due to similar brigades at the same table (although I'm not sure which ones)
Scott had a Judges deck as well. And a Prince Jonathan for mass banding between the two of us. It was awesome, but it really would have been better for me had we not had that, because then he would have had captain.
Royalty definitely seemed WAY more popular. Isaiah was pretty popular. Genesis, Judges, and Red seemed about the same, with mid/low popularity. I only saw one Hosea...
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Of the 6 new tins - Both the Red and Gold tin's have Black defenses, and there are two Green prophet tins. So we wanted to not have people drafting the same thing at the tables, as a result, there were essentially 4 'tables' which were combinations of tins that didn't duplicate anything. As a result, every table had the Genesis/Egyptian and Royalty tins.
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As for the original question, Goliath will not be shelved. He won't fit into every defense, but he is way too good to not include in a Philistine defense, Canaanite defenses (sure he decreases the potential of Tower but if you need to depend on Tower, just convert him, since he's a pretty decent hero as well) or even certain standalone defenses. Now that sitelock might start to rear its ugly head again (since the Boat can be sunk) he might be tossed in to return site access heroes/play Land Dispute.
Sure, Red will be more popular this year, but not everyone will play it, especially not in T1. And perhaps Goliath becomes a liability against Red, perhaps not. Just remember that Gomer/Spirit of Temptation can band to him CBI (unless Hosea is in play, which I suppose will happen more often now) so even a DT/Bravery of David/Ahimelech won't necessarily win the battle.
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Now that sitelock might start to rear its ugly head again (since the Boat can be sunk)
The issue now is that its so easy to kill sites with all these new cards.
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Now that sitelock might start to rear its ugly head again (since the Boat can be sunk)
The issue now is that its so easy to kill sites with all these new cards.
Right, but all of the other anti-site cards can/could be dealt with. Fishing Boat could not, until now.