Cactus Game Design Message Boards
Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Official Rules & Errata => Ruling Questions => Topic started by: emonier on May 08, 2017, 10:00:22 PM
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Dear All:
Can someone please tell me the difference between the two versions of the WOOL FLEECE artifact?
The Patriarchs version is very clear and easy to understand..."No evil characters may band."
But, the CoW version is different, and the language makes no sense to me..."Protect evil characters from band abilities."
What in the world does this (new) Cloud version mean?
Thank you,
EM
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It pretty much means exactly what it says. it does the same thing, except with a protect instead of a restrict. So the new one can be stopped with something that negates protects, the old one cannot.
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So, are you saying that the only difference is that the Patriarchs version is better (more powerful)?
Then, why did they make the CoW version? I don't get it.
Thanks,
EM
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It pretty much means exactly what it says. it does the same thing, except with a protect instead of a restrict. So the new one can be stopped with something that negates protects, the old one cannot.
Old wool fleece has always been ruled a prevent.
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I thought it was a restrict? I stand corrected then.So it is a protect instead of a prevent.
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Wool Fleece (Pa) prevents evil banding. All those CBN and CBP band abilities still work.
Wool Fleece (CoW) protects evil characters from being targeted by a band ability (including CBN and CBP ones). It can also be activated on Gideon.
I feel like the new one is way better, but that's just me.
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+1
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So, Gabe,
Please tell me if I am understanding this correctly. You said:
"Wool Fleece (CoW) protects evil characters from being targeted by a band ability"
So, does that mean that if I have Wool Fleece (CoW) activated, then I can still do all the banding I want with evil characters that I control that have banding (in their special abililties)? And likewise, my opponent(s) can still do all the evil banding they want as long as the evil banding ability is part of the evil character's special ability.
Is this right?
Thank you,
Eric
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Please tell me if I am understanding this correctly. You said:
"Wool Fleece (CoW) protects evil characters from being targeted by a band ability"
So, does that mean that if I have Wool Fleece (CoW) activated, then I can still do all the banding I want with evil characters that I control that have banding (in their special abililties)? And likewise, my opponent(s) can still do all the evil banding they want as long as the evil banding ability is part of the evil character's special ability.
Is this right?
Thank you,
Eric
From my very limited understanding...
No, because "Wool Fleece (CoW) protects evil characters from being targeted by a band ability".
No one can band any evil characters into battle, because the evil character that you are trying to band into battle cannot be targeted because of the gained protection.
It practically adds the special ability, "cannot be targeted by a band ability" to all evil characters.
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So, Gabe,
Please tell me if I am understanding this correctly. You said:
"Wool Fleece (CoW) protects evil characters from being targeted by a band ability"
So, does that mean that if I have Wool Fleece (CoW) activated, then I can still do all the banding I want with evil characters that I control that have banding (in their special abililties)? And likewise, my opponent(s) can still do all the evil banding they want as long as the evil banding ability is part of the evil character's special ability.
Is this right?
Thank you,
Eric
No, neither you nor your opponent can target characters either of you control with evil band abilities.
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WF doesn't allow evil characters to band, yours or your opponent's. Period. The way this is worded is to get around cards like the Forsaken LS that negates/prevents band abilities. The wording is strange but think of it this way: it protects evil characters from their OWN band abilities. Think of the story of the Midianites and Gideon in which this card/ability was based off of. It will make more sense that way in that they could not band with one another.
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OK,
So, practically speaking, the Wool Fleece (CoW) version does everything that the (Pa) version does, plus more?
Thank you,
Eric
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Yes except CoW WF gets around the negate/prevent band wording. The only way to stop WF's ability is to negate WF itself.
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Now, you can still band to an evil character from your hand with WF down.
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Now, you can still band to an evil character from your hand with WF down.
How is that?
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because the new wool fleece does not target characters to protect them from band abilities if they are not in play
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So more of an "add to the battle" ability, just not by a card (such as the new bowl that allows you to add a brown king to battle) if the card that's adding the EC to battle was already in play?
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cards out of play are not targeted by the cloud wool fleece's protect ability
add to battle has a band component if you already have a character in battle so that's a good question. i think the evil characters would be ruled to not be protected from it but it does make me wonder about:
household idols/faith of david
cloud wool fleece/sixth seal/gates of hell
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cards out of play are not targeted by the cloud wool fleece's protect ability
add to battle has a band component if you already have a character in battle so that's a good question. i think the evil characters would be ruled to not be protected from it but it does make me wonder about:
household idols/faith of david
cloud wool fleece/sixth seal/gates of hell
Add to battle is considered a band ability if it adds characters to a battle where character(s) of the same alignment are already present so CoW fleece would protect ECs from it.
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so if there isn't one..
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so if there isn't one..
Then its not a band ability so fleece wouldn't protect from it..
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What you guys are stating was the rule for a long time. In an effort to "untangle" as many abilities as possible "Add to Battle" was officially made it's own thing with the REG release (http://www.cactusforums.com/rules-announcements/add-to-battle-recieves-entry/) after Nationals 2016. There are some old cards that say "add to battle" when they only mean band. Those are still banding abilities. But most cards that add to battle are their own thing now.
Add to Battle
Last Updated: N/A
Released: 8/15/2016 (v4.0.0)
General Description
An add to battle ability brings a card into the current battle and activates its special ability.
How to Play
An add to battle ability targets the cards that are to be brought into battle. An add to battle ability is instantaneous.
Default Conditions
● Targets must be in a territory or in holder’s hand.
● Add to battle abilities target cards of the same alignment.
● Add to battle abilities can only add cards to a battle in which you are participating.
● Adding a card to battle causes the player on that side of the battle to control the card. If a different player normally has Permanent Control of the card, the player on that side of the battle gains Temporary Control until the card leaves battle.
Special Conditions
● A unique character can only enter the field of battle once per turn.
● When an add to battle ability adds multiple cards into battle, add them in any order and activate them one at a time in the order the cards were added. Exception: Abilities that add other characters to battle activate after all other abilities on cards added to battle.
Clarifications
● An add to battle ability is not a band ability unless it exclusively adds one or more characters to a side of the battle where at least one other character of the same alignment is always present.
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Now, you can still band to an evil character from your hand with WF down.
So, Gabe, is this accurate?
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Now, you can still band to an evil character from your hand with WF down.
So, Gabe, is this accurate?
Yes, based on the way that protect functions, with default targeting being the field of play.
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Ok thanks
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Wow.
I have no other words.
Thank you all.
-E
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I feel the same way. That part about the band still working if an EC wasn't in play but is banded to another EC just makes this already confusing wording an even more confusing play. It should be simply ECs are not permitted to band. Period.