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Author Topic: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns  (Read 2031 times)

Offline Gohanick

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Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« on: November 06, 2009, 11:30:53 PM »
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If woman at the well pulls out an evil character of toughness */3 or less, is it immediately discarded when placed in territory if crown of thorns is active?

The Woman at the Well
Type: Hero Char. • Brigade: Yellow • Ability: 3 / 4 • Class: None • Special Ability: Search opponent’s deck for a Lost Soul and a human Evil Character and put them in opponent’s territory. Cannot be negated. • Attributes: Samaritan • Identifiers: NT Female Human, Samaria • Verse: John 4:7 • Availability: Thesaurus ex Preteritus booster packs ()

Crown of Thorns
Type: Artifact • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: All Evil Characters in play decrease 0/3 while this card is in play. • Identifiers: None • Verse: John 19:2-3 • Availability: Warriors booster packs (Uncommon)
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browarod

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #1 on: November 06, 2009, 11:36:01 PM »
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I would think yes, since the EC is not in battle, but I'm not entirely positive.
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #2 on: November 06, 2009, 11:36:10 PM »
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No.

Ongoing Abilities > Increase or Decrease Ability > Default Conditions

•      Unless stated otherwise, characters in play with toughness  (*/0) or less during battle are not immediately discarded.  If the character is (*/0) or less at the end of battle, discard them (see Losing by Numbers in the rulebook [p. 20].
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browarod

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #3 on: November 06, 2009, 11:38:56 PM »
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Ah, gotten with a REG quote again >_>

I should give up for the night :P
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Offline Master KChief

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #4 on: November 06, 2009, 11:40:45 PM »
+1
ymt = new aggie. :)

you got ymt'd!
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Offline Cameron the Conqueror

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #5 on: November 07, 2009, 12:38:58 AM »
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Also, during the battle phase, no characters are discarded for being 0 toughness.
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #6 on: November 07, 2009, 12:56:02 AM »
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The Woman at the Well specifies territory.
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Offline Master KChief

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #7 on: November 07, 2009, 12:58:05 AM »
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yes, but all ec's in play with toughness 0 or lower wont be discarded until the end of battle.
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #8 on: November 07, 2009, 01:01:26 AM »
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Only characters in battle.  Characters in territory are discarded immediately, unless of course they have some protection from a fortress.
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Offline Master KChief

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #9 on: November 07, 2009, 01:31:08 AM »
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the REG says all evil characters in play. play = battle + territory.
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Offline Arch Angel

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #10 on: November 07, 2009, 02:13:21 AM »
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Quote from: YourMathTeacher on November 06, 2009, 11:36:10 PM
•      Unless stated otherwise, characters in play with toughness  (*/0) or less during battle are not immediately discarded.  If the character is (*/0) or less at the end of battle, discard them (see Losing by Numbers in the rulebook [p. 20].
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Ironica

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #11 on: November 07, 2009, 08:48:50 AM »
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Quote from: Arch Angel on November 07, 2009, 02:13:21 AM
Quote from: YourMathTeacher on November 06, 2009, 11:36:10 PM
•      Unless stated otherwise, characters in play with toughness  (*/0) or less during battle are not immediately discarded.  If the character is (*/0) or less at the end of battle, discard them (see Losing by Numbers in the rulebook [p. 20].

The second sentence (and the reference it gives) makes it sound like the first sentence is about all the heroes in battle.  The first sentence alone makes you think heroes in territory are safe but the second sentence adds context to the first sentence by describing the situation with the heroes in battle.
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #12 on: November 07, 2009, 08:55:22 AM »
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That is not true. The rest of my quote from the REG specifies to revert to the rulebook p.20:

NOTE: When a special ability reduces a character to */0 or less, the character is immediately discarded, EXCEPT during the Battle Phase. During Battle Resolution, all characters in play or set-aside areas with toughness of */0 or less at that time are discarded.

The rulebook clarifies that location is irrelevant, only the phase.
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Ironica

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #13 on: November 07, 2009, 10:00:06 AM »
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Quote from: YourMathTeacher on November 07, 2009, 08:55:22 AM
That is not true. The rest of my quote from the REG specifies to revert to the rulebook p.20:

NOTE: When a special ability reduces a character to */0 or less, the character is immediately discarded, EXCEPT during the Battle Phase. During Battle Resolution, all characters in play or set-aside areas with toughness of */0 or less at that time are discarded.

The rulebook clarifies that location is irrelevant, only the phase.

Good to know (especially since I'm about to host a tournament and I know this issue will come up (especially since I made all the decks that will be there :P).
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #14 on: November 07, 2009, 10:36:33 AM »
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Pardon me, I'm not sure when that REG entry was added/changed but it has huge impact on the battle phase by changing the number of characters in play.  And don't tell me it's been played that way always because it HASN'T!...



Wait.  I'm sorry.  I'm retired.  Forgive my intrusion.  Have a nice day!   :)
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Offline RTSmaniac

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #15 on: November 07, 2009, 11:16:02 AM »
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i agree with stamp. it has always been played the way he describes.

i am also open to new ideas and i see no problem with this change.
you could always just: woman at the well + passover = enter battle and place the evil character on bottom for the same effect...
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Offline Master KChief

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #16 on: November 07, 2009, 11:54:34 AM »
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actually, i've always played it as the reg states.
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Offline Bryon

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Re: Woman at the Well and Crown of Thorns
« Reply #17 on: November 07, 2009, 12:30:51 PM »
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Quote from: Master KChief on November 07, 2009, 11:54:34 AM
actually, i've always played it as the reg states.
As have I.  This has been in every rulebook since 2nd edition.  It is not a "change."

It is important that players read the rulebook.  Please, read the rulebook.  Don't just assume you know how to play.  There are a few little misconceptions like this that pop up from time to time simply because players thought they could skip sections in the rulebook.
« Last Edit: November 07, 2009, 12:33:56 PM by Bryon »
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