Author Topic: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?  (Read 5292 times)

Offline Jmbeers

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Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« on: April 29, 2012, 12:39:22 PM »
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Does Wool Fleece Negate all evil banding or Protect evil cards from banding?

I know it dosen't seem like a big difference but it makes it way stronger if it's a protect ability.
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.

Offline CJSports

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #1 on: April 29, 2012, 12:40:45 PM »
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It is a prevent ability.


Wool Fleece (Pa)

Type: Artifact • Brigade: None • Ability: None • Class: None • Special Ability: No Evil Characters may band • Play As: Evil Characters are prevented from banding. • Identifiers: None • Verse: Judges 6:36-38 • Availability: Patriarchs booster packs (Rare)
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Offline STAMP

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #2 on: April 29, 2012, 01:30:19 PM »
+1
I say this with unequivocal conviction:

Who knows anymore?  ;)


Seriously, it's been played as a prevent all these years yet is worded as a protect.  The way things are changing these days, even Split Altar has little ... chance ...

;D
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 04:39:32 PM by Prof Underwood »
Final ANB errata: Return player to game.

Chris

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #3 on: April 29, 2012, 01:31:45 PM »
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I'm actually reasonably sure it was ruled to be a protect ability, not a prevent.

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #4 on: April 29, 2012, 01:36:38 PM »
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Only Elder consensus can overrule the REG. Wool Fleece is a prevent until they say otherwise.
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Offline Jmbeers

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #5 on: April 29, 2012, 02:23:27 PM »
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Really feel like it should be changed to a protect. It is worded like one and it would make the card see more play.
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.

Offline christiangamer25

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #6 on: April 29, 2012, 02:26:18 PM »
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hmm just food for thought as a protect its also stoppable with stuff like iron pan but as a prevent its not and cbn banding aka gomer etc etc get thru it
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #7 on: April 29, 2012, 03:24:49 PM »
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Really feel like it should be changed to a protect. It is worded like one and it would make the card see more play.

I agree. We just need to convince the Elders.  ;)
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Offline Professoralstad

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #8 on: April 29, 2012, 04:07:29 PM »
+1
It is a prevent, and will remain that way for the foreseeable future.

There is a fairly good way to remember the differences to protect, prevent, and restrict on older cards:

When a card specifies that something cannot happen to it, it is a protect. i.e. "Lydia cannot be taken prisoner" can be reworded as Lydia is protected from capture).

When a card specifies that another card cannot do something, it is a prevent. i.e. "Evil Characters may not band" can be reworded as "Prevent abilities that allow Evil Characters to band"--which would be more in line with current wording rules than the current Play As, but saying the same thing. The current Play As is correct, just worded differently than it would be if WF were made today.

When a card specifies that an opponent cannot do something, it is a restrict. i.e. "Opponent may not make a rescue attempt" can be reworded as "Restrict opponent from making a rescue attempt."

Like everything, there may be exceptions, but I can't think of any.
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Offline megamanlan

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #9 on: April 29, 2012, 04:13:02 PM »
-1
So Cannot be is really a Protect? Wouldn't that mean that CBN cards can be rewritten as Protected from being Negated?
They seem pretty lame as fighters maybe we should challenge them to a dance off or a redemption game

Offline Jmbeers

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #10 on: April 29, 2012, 04:56:09 PM »
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So based Prof's descriptions I might actually argue that WF could be a restric (I know it doesn't reference opponent but the most common restric is CWD and that targets everyone, not just opponents (in case you didn't notice I really would prefer a better WF ;))
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.

Chris

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #11 on: April 29, 2012, 04:58:42 PM »
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So based Prof's descriptions I might actually argue that WF could be a restric (I know it doesn't reference opponent but the most common restric is CWD and that targets everyone, not just opponents (in case you didn't notice I really would prefer a better WF ;))

It's definitely not a restrict, because it's not targeting the opponent, it's targeting the opponent's characters.

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #12 on: April 29, 2012, 05:04:28 PM »
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It's definitely not a restrict, because it's not targeting the opponent, it's targeting the opponent's characters.

It is actually targetting everyone's evil characters, not that it changes your point.  ;)

According to the Professor, though, Wool Fleece targets any special ability that would cause ECs to band, even if they are on enhancements, artifacts, or whatever else.
« Last Edit: April 29, 2012, 05:06:43 PM by YourMathTeacher »
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Chris

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #13 on: April 29, 2012, 05:05:53 PM »
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It's definitely not a restrict, because it's not targeting the opponent, it's targeting the opponent's characters.

It is actually targetting everyone's evil characters, not that it changes your point.  ;)

 ::)

The point being restricts specifically target players, not players' cards.

Offline Jmbeers

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #14 on: April 29, 2012, 05:06:20 PM »
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 :doh:

Ok your right.
I'll go back to my little corner of denial and insist its a protect when deep deep inside I know it's not.

Thanks for the bad news everyone  ::)

(except you teach, I always liked math anyways :)
The only reason people get lost in thought is because it's unfamiliar territory.

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #15 on: April 29, 2012, 05:07:45 PM »
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(except you teach, I always liked math anyways :)

Who wouldn't?   ;D
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Offline megamanlan

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #16 on: April 29, 2012, 05:57:15 PM »
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@YourMathTeacher I know a few... But it's not me, I kinda like math.

I'd argue that Retricts are not that. Also CwD targets all players keeping them from playing Enhancements unless a Character is opposed in battle.
They seem pretty lame as fighters maybe we should challenge them to a dance off or a redemption game

Chris

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #17 on: April 29, 2012, 06:14:41 PM »
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(except you teach, I always liked math anyways :)

Who wouldn't?   ;D

Me. Math is hard and scary, and you don't get into opinions and theories until you're years past calculus. Soft sciences are nice and friendly.

Offline megamanlan

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2012, 07:05:51 PM »
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Political Science is fun. But all Science requires Math of some level.
(Don't even get me started on Physics... Idk how I got through it w/o knowing any Trigonometry at all...)
They seem pretty lame as fighters maybe we should challenge them to a dance off or a redemption game

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #19 on: April 29, 2012, 07:38:57 PM »
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Math is hard and scary, and you don't get into opinions and theories until you're years past calculus.

That's only because I wasn't your teacher.   ;)

My students love to debate about Chaos Theory, non-Euclidean Geometry, and the general theories about metacognition. My personal favorite is the discussion about the Indeterminate Forms, which I start as early as Algebra 2.  ;D
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Chris

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #20 on: April 29, 2012, 07:42:02 PM »
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I'll stick to Constitutional Law and whether Obama Care is constitutional, thanks.  ::)

Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #21 on: April 29, 2012, 07:42:56 PM »
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I'll stick to Constitutional Law and whether Obama Care is constitutional, thanks.  ::)

Now that's scary....  :maul:
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Offline Arrthoa

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #22 on: April 29, 2012, 08:59:04 PM »
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 +1

Offline christiangamer25

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #23 on: April 29, 2012, 09:05:36 PM »
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ok 2 words Fractal Math
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Offline YourMathTeacher

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Re: Is Wool Fleece a Negate or Protect?
« Reply #24 on: April 29, 2012, 09:07:35 PM »
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ok 2 words Fractal Math

You can't have a good discussion about Chaos Theory without first going over Fractals.  ;)
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