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Negate all special abilities on non-warrior class characters and non-weapon class enhancements.
A Negate All ability (Like Benaiah) is a single ongoing ability. It can negate everything before it was activated (like a prevent) and everything after it was played for the rest of the phase (like an interrupt), but it is technically neither one of those.
A Negate All ability (Like Benaiah) is a single ongoing ability. It can negate everything... after it was played for the rest of the phase (like an interrupt). If it is interrupted it will kick back in and negate enhancements played in the interrupt.All that Cannot be Prevented cares about is whether or not the Negate was active before or after it. If the CBP ability is played after the Negate ability the CBP ability works, if it is played before the Negate ability, the CBP ability can be negated.
I want to know how "negate-alls" can be defined in terms of specific Redemption abilities.
I don't see why Benaiah wouldn't negate a CBP enhancement after it is played.
Quote from: ChristianSoldier on June 13, 2013, 12:52:46 PMI don't see why Benaiah wouldn't negate a CBP enhancement after it is played.You are right. He would.
He actually doesn't, you said so yourself.
In any case, regarding Benaiah, you said that negate all prevents any special abilities played after them. You then said that CBP enhancements cannot be stopped by negate alls played before them. ChristianSoldier was saying that he doesn't understand why, based on the current post about Benaiah's ability negating Confusion after its played, why that wouldn't also mean a CBP enhancement (while not prevented before being played) isn't then immediately negated after its played.
why, based on the current post about Benaiah's ability negating Confusion after its played,
why that wouldn't also mean a CBP enhancement (while not prevented before being played) isn't then immediately negated after its played.
Hopefully we're all on the same page now
If a CBP enhancement is played AFTER Ben enters battle, then it would still work. This is because although he is preventing all regular enhancements played after he entered battle, that wouldn't stop something that was CBP.
You are forgetting (or don't know) that Negate is not the same as interrupt and prevent. If negates were still Interrupt + Prevent, I'd say your suggestion of how Negate All should work would have some merit, but as Negate is it's own ability separate from Interrupt and Prevent, while it does something similar to the two of them then it works fine the way it is.
You are forgetting (or don't know) that Negate is not the same as interrupt and prevent.
You are forgetting that Benaiah is both preventing and negating all cards that enter battle, otherwise Confusion would work, because a prevent wouldn't stop Confusion after it activated. So a CBP enhancement should be negated after it activates.
So if it only negates backwards and only prevents forwards, why would an enhancement played on the tail end of an ITB+Play Next be negated?
Similarly imagine I play a "negate all" GE on my hero, and your blocker plays 2kh followed by Confusion. The preventing of all your enhancements is paused while you draw 2 cards, but if you don't play a card to remove my "negate all" GE or my hero from battle, then your enhancements (like Confusion) are still prevented.
I guess I'm just confused (no pun intended) on how a special ability that was already played and carried out can be prevented after the fact (like Confusion in this case).
Quote from: Legolas on February 08, 2016, 09:07:46 PMIs negate an ongoing ability?Yes, the prevent component of it is.
Is negate an ongoing ability?
Abilities that are worded “negate all special abilities” (even if the ability includes an exception or is limited to all special abilities of a certain type, but does not say “currently in battle”) are actually a combination of a prevent and a negate ability. They should be played as “negate all [specified set of abilities] in play and prevent all [specified set of abilities] for remainder of battle.”
A negate ability that undoes abilities that have already completes is instantaneous, as an interrupt.A negate ability that prevents uncompleted abilities from activating is ongoing, as a prevent.
A prevent ability keeps the uncompleted activation of an ability from ever completing.
If an ability is prevented, its activation cannot begin. If an ability is prevented and its activation has already begun but it has not completed activation (i.e. it is a pending ability), the completion of the activation of the pending ability is skipped (i.e., it is no longer a pending ability even though it did not complete its activation). An ability can not be prevented if its activation has already completed.
The phrase “interrupt the battle” includes interrupting the following:● all active ongoing abilities● abilities that are defeating one of the characters you control in battle● the last card played in current battle if it was played by your opponent
Are you guys saying that you can interrupt fbtn? Strong angel attacks. Play interrupt Joseph in prison on small black ec. In the past jip is negated. Now are you saying that jip works? If so this is a huge change in the way we play.
Ok thanks. I misunderstood the other post.
I agree, what is written is a little confusing. I had to read it a couple times to understand it.FTR, the original ruling in the 2nd post on this thread still holds true, Confusion is negated based on the example given. ITB will interrupt the last card played by the opponent (in the example given that's Benaiah). It doesn't just interrupt his ongoing (prevent) ability but his entire "negate all" ability. When the interrupt ends, Benaiah's entire ability reactivates, not just the prevent portion.If Benaiah is holding Eleazar's Sword, that will be the last card played, in which case only Benaiah's prevent ability is negated, allowing Confusion to stick.
Um, no. The last card played would have to be the EC otherwise what would you be playing the ItB card on?
ItB doesn't interrupt the last card played by the opponent, it interrupts the last card if it was played by the opponent, so no I didn't miss a part that wasn't there.