Author Topic: New set speculation (Read 11257 times)

AJ · « **Reply #75 on:** March 20, 2014, 04:50:08 PM »

Anywho..... The real question is will Rob reboot the game? I do not care at this point if the cards are in randomized packs rapped in bacon or if they are in LCG format. I just really want a reboot.

YourMathTeacher · « **Reply #76 on:** March 20, 2014, 07:21:14 PM »

Quote from: Westy on March 19, 2014, 08:06:52 PM

Ultra rares were almost 10 years ago.

Now they are full-body art with neat little ripples in the cards....

AJ · « **Reply #77 on:** March 20, 2014, 10:27:35 PM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on March 20, 2014, 07:21:14 PM

Quote from: Westy on March 19, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Ultra rares were almost 10 years ago.

Now they are full-body art with neat little ripples in the cards....

No your thinking of ........ A wrong thread

Alex_Olijar · « **Reply #78 on:** March 21, 2014, 08:17:09 AM »

Quote from: Drrek on March 17, 2014, 08:01:25 PM

I love the pretty much every idea from Olijar's post (though that's totally not set rotation, and it bothers me that you only say it technically isn't set rotation. It just plain isn't set rotation). The only reason I'd be opposed to a reboot from I/J would be because of the money and effort I've put into my collection and decks from pre-I/J but an official unrestricted type takes away those concerns. And while that format might have a terrible unbalanced meta, that isn't really that much different from the current meta and I'd still have fun playing in it anyway. Also I would love if multiplayer were eliminated as official categories. It frees up time in tournaments for better categories by eliminating what is in my opinion the weakest of all categories. Multiplayer might be fun in casual play, but I personally don't think it deserves a place in official categories. So all in all I am a fan of the idea of a reboot using post-I/J as long as we keep a format for pre-I/J.

It's not "set rotation" because Redemption doesn't have "sets". Otherwise, I think it is.

Quote from: EmJayBee83 on March 18, 2014, 11:15:09 PM

I really like the idea of a reboot. I think it is a necessary thing if we hope to have a vibrant Redemption see its 25th anniversary. I have three items for further discussion...

First, I see you kept booster and sealed. I assume the booster would be the "unlimited" closed format and sealed would be the reboot one. Is this correct?

Second, I wouldn't be in such a hurry to dump multi-player. Especially if the primary reason really is solely to make Nats scheduling more convenient. Having a good multi-player capability out of the box is a selling point for the game overall. In games that don't have it (e.g. Legend of the Five Rings) multi-player always ends up being one of the most requested items by the player base.

Third, I hope that any serious consideration of a game reboot would also include taking a fresh look at the distribution model as well. Right now the size of the player base makes Redemption borderline (at best) as a viable collectible game. Couple that with the huge shift in the Christian retail landscape over the past 20 years, and you have a real problem going forward.

1. Hadn't thought about the formats for sealed and booster, I personally would be fine with eliminating both, I just figured people wouldn't like that. What you say makes sense though.

2. You can still include MP rules in the book but there's no reason to play an inferior version of the game in tournaments.

Quote from: AJ on March 19, 2014, 09:13:56 PM

Quote from: Westy on March 19, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Ultra rares were almost 10 years ago.

Exactly why the game isn't doing as good as it was 10 years ago.

Nope.

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #79 on:** March 21, 2014, 08:29:16 AM »

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on March 20, 2014, 07:21:14 PM

Quote from: Westy on March 19, 2014, 08:06:52 PM
Ultra rares were almost 10 years ago.

Now they are full-body art with neat little ripples in the cards....

After a first glance, I almost reported this to the moderators. Then I re-read each word more carefully.

Master KChief · « **Reply #80 on:** March 21, 2014, 02:10:42 PM »

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on March 21, 2014, 08:17:09 AM

It's not "set rotation" because Redemption doesn't have "sets". Otherwise, I think it is.

I'm pretty sure what everyone means by 'sets' is 'expansions'. What you may be referring to is 'blocks', as in, a multitude of successive expansions (that usually share the same theme), which Redemption doesn't really have. But Drrek is saying how the proposal fails to demonstrate any kind of rotation...set, block, or otherwise. Are there plans to consistently remove expansions or whole blocks from the format to allow new expansions to enter the format? If so, that is rotation. But it seems to me to just be a banning of all cards pre-IJ and reboot from IJ forward.

_JM_ · « **Reply #81 on:** March 21, 2014, 02:32:00 PM »

Quote from: Master KChief on March 21, 2014, 02:10:42 PM

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on March 21, 2014, 08:17:09 AM
It's not "set rotation" because Redemption doesn't have "sets". Otherwise, I think it is.

I'm pretty sure what everyone means by 'sets' is 'expansions'. What you may be referring to is 'blocks', as in, a multitude of successive expansions (that usually share the same theme), which Redemption doesn't really have. But Drrek is saying how the proposal fails to demonstrate any kind of rotation...set, block, or otherwise. Are there plans to consistently remove expansions or whole blocks from the format to allow new expansions to enter the format? If so, that is rotation. But it seems to me to just be a banning of all cards pre-IJ and reboot from IJ forward.

I agree with MKC - can't really call your proposal 'set rotation', Alex. MtG Standard is set rotation - your idea is more like their Modern/Legacy split. It is a fantastic idea, though, no matter the name of it.

Looking at Closed Deck structure, I would definitely see Sealed as I/J onward. Booster, at least through the first expansion or two, would probably have to be Unlimited. After the release of the third expansion in the (Modern? Structured? Need a word other than reboot...) era, booster could shift to just those expansions.

Sadness · « **Reply #82 on:** March 21, 2014, 08:43:15 PM »

If you get the banning of all cards prior to the I/J deck,what do you want done with those cards? Redemption tournaments with old cards for fun,recycling,drink holders?

Personally if we do a reboot I suggest we vote here-on the boards-for that.

Here are a few questions/thoughts for yall.

1) A post for Rob to read as to what cards you'd like to see in the next few sets.
2) What to do with the old cards?
3) What current sets to carry over with the reboot till more cards come out?

DJWeb · « **Reply #83 on:** March 21, 2014, 09:12:31 PM »

I think something like a reboot might be good for the game, but being a recent returnee to the game, I would like to see something like this happen real slowly. I feel like I am just now getting caught up after my several year hiatus from the game, so I would be disappointed if I could not use all the cards and decks I have recently gotten.

This would be my ideal "reboot". All of the pre-I/J cards would stop being printed. But these cards and T1/T2 as we know it would be the main categories for several years. A few large new sets would be printed over these new few years (lots of reprints would be fine), and they could only be used, along with I and J, in the new categories of the future. Theoretically, these would transition into the norm and eventually, the old cards and categories would become obsolete (could still be played, but would not be the main ones). This way, older players won't be forced with the change, and new players will "grow up" with the new Redemption. I think that makes sense.

AJ · « **Reply #84 on:** March 21, 2014, 09:27:00 PM »

Quote from: Sadness on March 21, 2014, 08:43:15 PM

If you get the banning of all cards prior to the I/J deck,what do you want done with those cards? Redemption tournaments with old cards for fun,recycling,drink holders?

Personally if we do a reboot I suggest we vote here-on the boards-for that.

Here are a few questions/thoughts for yall.

1) A post for Rob to read as to what cards you'd like to see in the next few sets.
2) What to do with the old cards?
3) What current sets to carry over with the reboot till more cards come out?

It's already been stated that if a reboot were to happen, there would be an unlimited format where all cards can be used. I do agree with the forum poll though.

Isildur · « **Reply #85 on:** March 22, 2014, 01:46:03 AM »

If I am not mistaken what Alex is proposing is not set rotation but is creating two separate game formats... yes? This has proven to work by a number of older games to work... VS, Magic and Decipher games to name a few... annnd if I'm not mistaken this means you are in support of a reboot of sorts yes?

Just trying to decipher the wall of text

Sadness · « **Reply #86 on:** March 22, 2014, 07:15:14 AM »

Aj, when it was stated that unlimited would be used-I thought they meant unlimited set only. Aka the original set or the cheap blue packs.

Thanks for clearing that up.

TheJaylor · « **Reply #87 on:** March 22, 2014, 11:47:43 AM »

Quote from: Isildur on March 22, 2014, 01:46:03 AM

If I am not mistaken what Alex is proposing is not set rotation but is creating two separate game formats... yes? This has proven to work by a number of older games to work... VS, Magic and Decipher games to name a few... annnd if I'm not mistaken this means you are in support of a reboot of sorts yes?

Just trying to decipher the wall of text

I believe that is all correct from what I understood.

Sadness · « **Reply #88 on:** March 23, 2014, 07:04:59 AM »

Does anybody know any of the cards that are being considered for the new set? I'd like to see a Matthis in purple since he replaced Judas as the 12th apostle. I wouldn't mind seeing a Josephus promo card or a McBees promo card. I realize that they're technically not in the Bible,however they are part of it. Also will there be a Saul and Paul reprint?

I'll come back later and correct my spelling.

jbeers285 · « **Reply #89 on:** March 23, 2014, 07:53:10 AM »

Quote from: Sadness on March 23, 2014, 07:04:59 AM

Does anybody know any of the cards that are being considered for the new set? I'd like to see a Matthis in purple since he replaced Judas as the 12th apostle. I wouldn't mind seeing a Josephus promo card or a McBees promo card. I realize that they're technically not in the Bible,however they are part of it. Also will there be a Saul and Paul reprint?

I'll come back later and correct my spelling.

No not McBees, NYTO that new fortress called Mickey-D's. It grants obesity to all children under the age of 10 and is CBN if you put Ronald McDonald in play.

Ba da ba da da, I'm lovin' it.

I think you where looking for Maccabees, the Jewish people who lead the rebillion which at one point took control of Judea and held it for about 100 years?

AJ · « **Reply #90 on:** March 23, 2014, 08:53:14 AM »

Quote from: Sadness on March 23, 2014, 07:04:59 AM

Does anybody know any of the cards that are being considered for the new set? I'd like to see a Matthis in purple since he replaced Judas as the 12th apostle. I wouldn't mind seeing a Josephus promo card or a McBees promo card. I realize that they're technically not in the Bible,however they are part of it. Also will there be a Saul and Paul reprint?

I'll come back later and correct my spelling.

1. No only the PTB knows what cards are in the set.
2. The Redemption definition of Disciple is " One of the 12 who walked with Jesus" since Matthias was after Jesus' ascension he will go in whatever color the early church is in.
3. No ST Patrick was bad enough. We don't need more non biblical people in the game.
4. I would like to think so.

jbeers285 · « **Reply #91 on:** March 23, 2014, 10:34:04 AM »

1. Sadness stated apostle not disciple.
2. Some the elders release hints about cards or possible reprints so there may be some people who know a little more then they are admitting.
3. What makes St. Patrick bad?
4. I really like Saul/Paul but a reprint with a more useable Paul woul be cool. Or perhaps a couple ways to very easily convert Saul to Paul without much cost.

TheJaylor · « **Reply #92 on:** March 23, 2014, 08:25:49 PM »

Quote from: jbeers285 on March 23, 2014, 10:34:04 AM

1. Some the elders release hints about cards or possible reprints so there may be some people who know a little more then they are admitting.
2. Sadness stated apostle not disciple.
3. What makes St. Patrick bad?
4. I really like Saul/Paul but a reprint with a more useable Paul woul be cool. Or perhaps a couple ways to very easily convert Saul to Paul without much cost.

FTFY

As far as number 2 goes, I think he was mostly trying to figure out which brigade he would be a part of, whether it be purple or "Early Church brigade".

EmJayBee83 · « **Reply #93 on:** March 31, 2014, 08:09:04 AM »

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on March 17, 2014, 09:39:06 AM

Regardless of if you agree or not, I’m just going to go right into my proposal. Technically this isn’t really my proposal for the most part, but rather a group thought that developed over the summer, but I’m not at liberty to discuss who it came from. It is important to note that this idea is probably not able to be implemented until another 1-2 set releases.

1. Create a “new” format. This format would be the rotated format. The format would begin at I/J starter decks. This is the perfect starting point because a new card look was introduced, making it obvious which cards are legal in this new format. You could also continue to play tournaments in the “unlimited” format with all cards legal for those who would like to do so.
2. Eliminate multiplayer. I probably enjoy type 1 MP as much as anyone in the world, but it’s broken. It’s just not how the game is designed to be played. Ditto for Teams. As for T2 MP, if the game is played properly, it should never finish in time barring weird draws, so even the better meta still makes for painful games.

Counter proposal to #1: Create a new format where all out-of-print and post-Priests expansion cards are not allowed. All of the cards from the Limited, Apostles, Prophets, Kings, Angel Wars and Priests expansions and all starter decks would remain legal. With the exception of the of the 2-Liner, I believe this would remove from the card pool all of the OP cards that have been discussed as candidates for the various ban lists. Each card from the post-Priests expansions would be re-examined for suitability and those meeting the appropriate criteria would be re-packaged and re-released.

Counter proposal to #2: If no reboot or "set rotation" or whatever takes place, eliminate T1 as a play category. Focus all development effort on attempting to shore up and improve T2 which is currently the sole constructed category which has a semblance of a reasonable meta.

Both of these are (of course) meant for discussion. Question/comments/concerns/love-its/hate-its/and-so-ons welcome.

AJ · « **Reply #94 on:** March 31, 2014, 02:58:02 PM »

Part of the reason for the reboot is to get rid of all the terribly worded cards and this would just make these cards see more use. This does nothing but keeps people useing old cards like ANB that gives the elders and judges headaches and forces them to take an aspirin. As to number 2, I would just turn T1 into T3. It's pretty much like T2 but doesn't make people spend the abundance of cash that T2 does. I just think Redemption needs a complete Reboot to get rid of all the bad days of sloppily worded cards and Pokemon professors. This gives them a chance to start pretty much from ground up with power creep. Imagine how happy the elders would be if they only had to keep in mind when making the new set is IJ? They wouldn't have to worry about some random Apostle common making one of the new cards broken. My proposal is,

1. Turn Redemption completely into an LCG.
2. Have a reboot from IJ up and replace T1 with T3 and eliminate multiplayer. This one would make people play defense. So the categories would be T1 and T2 "unlimited,and T3 and T2 reboot.

Because it would be an LCG people wouldn't have to track down a bunch of rares and ultra rares and it would eliminate the closed categories which would free up room for new interesting categories.

News:

Author Topic: New set speculation (Read 11257 times)