Also, they are pretty cool. But, where is Moses' ability?
The artwork looks alot better too.
The artwork looks alot better too.
Well, that's one problem with this game. For the most part, they have to simply acquire rights to other artwork, so the quality and style of the card art is all over the map.
If Cactus could afford dedicated artists, the quality and consistency would improve drastically.
Yeah, take these two for example. Both are from the same set:
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cactusgamedesign.com%2FREG%2FLinkedDocuments%2FMessenger%2520of%2520Satan%2520%28Ap%29.gif&hash=4b1d952772d8ef5f1ac710f16e1a99f89da87765)(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cactusgamedesign.com%2FREG%2FLinkedDocuments%2FTitus%2520%28Ap%29.gif&hash=bdc8e1958c764ceb1a9c9070ef684769e4f48320)
Updated with 2 cards
-Fixed brigade situation. Only the brigade box indicated brigade colour.
-Updated background. Something a little more subtle.
-Updated art style (not as cartoony)
Here's my first go at a rework of the original card layout. I didn't change it a ton, but I feel this is much easier to read.
Graphics and all that could easily be changed, but I'm focusing on the layout of information. Yeah I know the ability / numbers are not TSA's real ones, but I wanted to find the longest SA I could for the "worst case scenario" of the design.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz18%2FLambo_Diablo_Svtt%2Ftemplatetest.jpg&hash=1c5901fb57aa959eed7a1fc3eeced45aeddf5569)
Daniel, I suggest you try fitting the special ability of The Darkness into the Samson card... You're gonna have space issues there.That is true, although I suppose in an extreme situation like that, when decreasing the font size wouldn't help, you could make the bible verse just a reference like "~Isaiah 20:6"
That's one of the big issues we have to deal with on this kind of project. The special ability and verse together is a lot of text to fit into a small card, and both can vary in length greatly.
Always design a text area with the WORST case scenario in mind.
I've considered that, but even that has it's own repercussions.Well, its nothing new. Promos are in the same situation.
Some abilities refer to words in the scripture box. I'm not sure if you'd then have to just look up the verse, or if it legally wouldn't work with a card printed like that.
So many things to consider.
Now that is a fly-looking template. Modernizes the look without completely abandoning the classic style.
For identifiers, perhaps have icons for each? Maybe it's just me, but I've always liked visual indications of whether something is a goblin or a musician or whatever. The downside is you'd need a glossary for some of them (like Assyrians), but there aren't too many different identifiers and most would be self-explanatory. That way things that define X or whatnot wouldn't be crowding other bits of words.
I don't really care for the square with abilities and scripture reference. It's really, well, square. Perhaps a better way to put it is bland and unoriginal. The scroll doesn't have give as much room, sure, but it's much cooler IMO.
Obviously, I would like any design that Rob can afford to continue producing expansion sets. I love the game and don't ever want to see it go away. :)
But if I had my druthers, I really like the designs posted above by Daniel. I like the textured papyrus for the text box and frayed borders of the artwork.
I do have one thing to say about identifiers. I really would prefer to put the onus on the players to determine if a character is an angel or Babylonian, or if a card depicts a weapon, rather than filling up a card. Obviously, some will have to remain, like what determines "X". But like Scrabble, you go to the official book, the dictionary, to validate words. I'd really like to see Bibles cracked at playgroups and tournaments. :thumbup:
Better, though I don't like the numbers being in their own box. Seems like wasted space.I don't really care for the square with abilities and scripture reference. It's really, well, square. Perhaps a better way to put it is bland and unoriginal. The scroll doesn't have give as much room, sure, but it's much cooler IMO.
Better?
I also tried something different with the icon box.
(quoted image removed)
Your cards have an Anachronism feel to it.Yeah Anachronism, A Game of Thrones and Dominion were design inspiration.
One thing I've noticed is that your brigade colors are a bit off. Here is the guide I use, which I created from scans/REG images. I've also provided the correct text color to use on each brigade.I use a similar guide but I just forgot to utilize it for this new template.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz18%2FLambo_Diablo_Svtt%2Fcolorguide4.jpg&hash=554839ca8e623fb6a8aab0dc660d6415343333b7)
*EDIT* I goofed. Fixed some of the text colors.
One thing I've noticed is that your brigade colors are a bit off. Here is the guide I use, which I created from scans/REG images. I've also provided the correct text color to use on each brigade.I use a similar guide but I just forgot to utilize it for this new template.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fi189.photobucket.com%2Falbums%2Fz18%2FLambo_Diablo_Svtt%2Fcolorguide4.jpg&hash=554839ca8e623fb6a8aab0dc660d6415343333b7)
*EDIT* I goofed. Fixed some of the text colors.
Dominants an explosion of furious win, etc. If you're going to go, may as well go big!
Yes, because I want to drop my Doubt like a boss.
I noticed you're still missing the icon for the good Dominant. I think I may have found the solution to your problem:+1'ed. Actually I decided on a lion since finding a cool lamb picture has been stressful.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.crossfithoboken.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2010%2F09%2Fc_documents_and_settings_notandi_my_documents_my_pictures_killer_sheep.jpg&hash=319381030a04124e95cc0c6f2d1d55403e054dda)
The next preview will include about 8 updated cards. There will be at least:
-1 Artifact
-1 Good Fortress
-1 Evil Fortress
-1 Lost Soul
-1 Site
....
Any suggestions for other cards you'd like to see reprinted in this style?
Hahaha lambo that was awesome!!
Here's an example of an evil dominant (ps. lambo i wasn't trying to copy you with the grim reaper but that was by far the best of the options for a small space)
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8322%2F7946320808_2130749bd6_b.jpg&hash=ea546f9051774143f5b0a8c01145fc98ec3caf1f)
I went ahead and created 2 Fortresses, an Artifact and a Lost Soul.
The next 4 cards will be posted either tomorrow (Saturday) or the day after.
Where did you guys get that art from? How would you make that work with actually publishing the cards?
What if Cactus had an art scholarship program where students could submit their work and win X amount of dollars for college? I've seen plenty of great quality art from college and high school students. Couldn't this be a win/win? The legal/financial details would have to be worked out but basically Cactus gets permission to use any art that is submitted in the competition and the students have a chance to earn money for college and get their work used professionally which I think would be good for their portfolio. I think you might be able to get a fair amount of entries because the range of subject matter is large and almost any art style is possible. Cactus could also benefit by not just using art for Redemption but for their other board games, rulebooks, website, etc. This could also help broaden their exposure to new students and even colleges/high schools if they partner with them.
I mentioned this idea to Rob and he didn't seem opposed but just inclined to think it would take a lot of time he didn't have to set up. He may have been joking but I think he even said that I was welcome to do it. Thoughts?
For characters and enhancements, it's just comparable (assuming border busters in the current template), but for Dominants, Fortresses, and (the way I see it in my head) Curses/Covenants/Artifacts, the new template is way better.
i disagree with this statement, cause my love for the game is keeping me from quitting and therefore tells me the game won't die. for Redemption to die is very unlikely considering the unique style of the game and just the game as a whole is just original. and all i have to say is; eat your heart out yugioh pokemon, and magic; the gathering. what redemption has what others dont is redemption is much more then JUST a card game for people to play, it's a bible study in within itself cause of the references on almost every card and it is my firm belief that as long as all of us as players in the game who love the game for what it is which is God's game then Redemption will never die.
Imo if the game doesnt get a FULL 256 card or more set ASAP the game will die due to lack of keeping older and newer players due to interest.
Imo too many people are being wooed by the art and not the actual card design its self.For myself personally, I am being wooed by the card design. The best thing to point to here is to look at cards like Enchanter and King Asa that have the existing art in the new design, and Lambo's side-by-side Abaddons. In all of those cases, I strongly prefer Daniel's redesign--it has a much more modern look and moving text outside the art is wonderful.
The redesign might be an idea for the future but by no means should it be done to the next set of starters.Are you making a general claim that a starter set would not be the best time to introduce a redesign or are you just saying the upcoming starter specifically would not be the best time?
Also note DC VS tcg tried to do change their template with their last set and look at where it got them? No where! The game died the set afterwords.Saving the game is a big chunk to bite off. I don't think anyone is claiming that a redesign will save the game. My personal belief that having a card design that matches up style-wise with the best of what is out there would be a selling point, however.
Are you making a general claim that a starter set would not be the best time to introduce a redesign or are you just saying the upcoming starter specifically would not be the best time?
The text over the horizontal cards is actually saving artwork not covering it up. Either you have boxes behind the text and cover up art or you simply write the text over the art and get a much more appealing image.For characters and enhancements, it's just comparable (assuming border busters in the current template), but for Dominants, Fortresses, and (the way I see it in my head) Curses/Covenants/Artifacts, the new template is way better.
I actually prefer Daniel's vertical cards to his horizontal ones.
The horizontal cards are simply text on the image, which is the primary problem I have with the real template.
Hey Arrthoa, come join us here in Orlando. Four new players added this month, so we have over 15 committed players. I will be scheduling tournaments soon, especially with the newly announced promo reshuffle. Let me know what dates will work for you to come up this way.I would like to but I am in the Cape Coral/Ft. Myers area so it is quite a hike to Orlando for me. But I would like to join a tournament sometime. I am a on-call worker so let me know the dates you are planing on and I can mark them down.
I don't think you need to take up so much space describing card rarity. Also, make sure the ability/verse box is the same size as the image box (it looks slightly smaller to me, just check and make sure its the same).It is the same. It probably looks a little bit smaller because the image box has a soft shadow. I also think I prefer this style to the grungy scrolls design.
I really like the template you've designed for Trumpeting Angel and Evil Spawn. The outline on the typeface really makes it pop. Putting the SA and scripture in the same box is a huge improvement over the current design. I also like the inclusion of the Redemption "R" at the bottom left.
The only thing I'd add are some of Lambo's blended borders. Those are beautiful.
Oh, and the ability "place them under opponent's deck" can now be shorted with one keyword - "underdeck them". :)
daniel the illustrastion for your version of prince of this world is SWEEEET!! Im just loving how his staff is just hanging right out of the picture and being in front of the scroll below, it gives the card some character. just saying and one question that bothers me, what does the ##/100 mean anyway? i don't really get that, could somebody help me understand? and i just love the idea of the Redemption R symbol being at the bottom left corner of the card
that's a neat concept :) but you do know there are over 2000 cards in the game but i can understand you would use that number as an example of a card's number which is very useful for collectorsdaniel the illustrastion for your version of prince of this world is SWEEEET!! Im just loving how his staff is just hanging right out of the picture and being in front of the scroll below, it gives the card some character. just saying and one question that bothers me, what does the ##/100 mean anyway? i don't really get that, could somebody help me understand? and i just love the idea of the Redemption R symbol being at the bottom left corner of the card
The #/100 just indicates the card's number. Say there is a starter deck of 50 cards, it would be 34/50 or 02/50.
A lot of the edges and corners of your design looks very thick; I think they would look better if they were about 50% thinner. Otherwise, I like your cards, particularly TSA.
Yeah, that's what I had in mind.A lot of the edges and corners of your design looks very thick; I think they would look better if they were about 50% thinner. Otherwise, I like your cards, particularly TSA.
The only ones I see that might be too thick are the main black outline around the card, and the ability/verse box outline.
I still suggest the signpost icons for identifiers are the final pieces of the puzzle.
@Raven, I like your idea a lot. The only problem I see is that a CCG should never change the card back. Once you design the card back, you can't ever revisit it. But I really do like your idea. :)might not work for redemption seeing as redemption already has a reverse side of the card but it would work if it was for a different card game. and im pleased that at least ONE of my ideas was actually a good idea for once :) :) :) :)
Another potential problem I could see is that there are some old people that already have a hard time reading the cards.watch who your callin old young feller ;)
Another potential problem I could see is that there are some old people that already have a hard time reading the cards. While it's much better to have the SA's printed the way you have them, there'd be a inordinate amount of squinting at cards from far away going on.
Beast(Borderline, and I struck it through because every Beast has Beast in the title)
Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.in this case you should say "no pun intended" ;)
That last part was not a pun, if anyone thought it was.
Here's my take on an identifier symbol system.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8051%2F8090710318_5638eabe7c_b.jpg&hash=7ebd83bf13fd7dbf5ef3d6a77dc7d911ef83d9a9)
Hey Lambo, when you were picking out the new EE/EC/Hero icons did you just google "Prison tattoos"? 'Cuz that's what they make me think of :P
While I like the redesign and art, we need to remember that this is a christian card game. The art seems to be like that of Magic and Yugioh which Mr. Rob saw as dark if you have read the background of the game. Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.
No pun intended on that last sentence.
While I like the redesign and art, we need to remember that this is a christian card game. The art seems to be like that of Magic and Yugioh which Mr. Rob saw as dark if you have read the background of the game. Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.
No pun intended on that last sentence.
I agree. Although, the art on the new Astrologer design represents the type of person they were and what they practiced. But I do understand what you are saying as a former magic player myself.
While I like the redesign and art, we need to remember that this is a christian card game. The art seems to be like that of Magic and Yugioh which Mr. Rob saw as dark if you have read the background of the game. Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.
No pun intended on that last sentence.
I agree. Although, the art on the new Astrologer design represents the type of person they were and what they practiced. But I do understand what you are saying as a former magic player myself.
I'm pretty sure astrologers back then didn't have claws on their hands. ;)
While I like the redesign and art, we need to remember that this is a christian card game. The art seems to be like that of Magic and Yugioh which Mr. Rob saw as dark if you have read the background of the game. Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.
No pun intended on that last sentence.
I agree. Although, the art on the new Astrologer design represents the type of person they were and what they practiced. But I do understand what you are saying as a former magic player myself.
I'm pretty sure astrologers back then didn't have claws on their hands. ;)
While I like the redesign and art, we need to remember that this is a christian card game. The art seems to be like that of Magic and Yugioh which Mr. Rob saw as dark if you have read the background of the game. Yet, I do agree that some cards need a major art improvement we need to stay away from the dark arts.
No pun intended on that last sentence.
I agree. Although, the art on the new Astrologer design represents the type of person they were and what they practiced. But I do understand what you are saying as a former magic player myself.
I'm pretty sure astrologers back then didn't have claws on their hands. ;)
Because claws are a modern discovery? ::)
That argument stopped holding water a little while ago. If you're not able to generate 4+ souls yourself, your'e doin' it wrong.
NomireX if you haven't figured out any reasons to battle challenge then i've no clue what to say. A battle challenge is actually quite strategic.Eh. Most of the time it's not strategic, but it certainly can be. A lot of times it's just whether you want to draw cards and potentially get souls or not. It's a coin flip, not strategic. Although, I entirely disagree that they should be dropped. They have won and lost me many games (like when Gabe battle challenged me with Susanna and grabbed the 2 Liner at 2010 Nats so I couldn't get to 5. Most frustrating game ever...).
NomireX if you haven't figured out any reasons to battle challenge then i've no clue what to say. A battle challenge is actually quite strategic.
NomireX if you haven't figured out any reasons to battle challenge then i've no clue what to say. A battle challenge is actually quite strategic.
NomireX if you haven't figured out any reasons to battle challenge then i've no clue what to say. A battle challenge is actually quite strategic.
I also do not see much use in battle challenges. Sure, you can activate an ability. But my point is that typically, when a battle challenge would benefit you, your opponent would not accept. I have never accepted a battle challenge. It doesn't have advantages defensively. I have not played any good competition, but I haven't seen anyone take advantage of a battle challenge.
This coming from my little knowledge and experience... ;). Weston
But activating the ability is the advantage. Drawing cards/discarding cards/searching is so powerful just using the SA is worth it. I absolutely would quit competitive play if battle challenges were removed.NomireX if you haven't figured out any reasons to battle challenge then i've no clue what to say. A battle challenge is actually quite strategic.
I also do not see much use in battle challenges. Sure, you can activate an ability. But my point is that typically, when a battle challenge would benefit you, your opponent would not accept. I have never accepted a battle challenge. It doesn't have advantages defensively. I have not played any good competition, but I haven't seen anyone take advantage of a battle challenge.
This coming from my little knowledge and experience... ;). Weston
This is what I was thinking as well Weston.
So back on topic, I think we need to get petition going for the redesigns to become reality. Does the creator of the game ever read these boards?
It would be beneficial to the game and the community if the redesign was implemented asap.
And since the back of the card is not changing all redesigns would be compatible with old cards as well, so no one can complain about that.
I'm not sure they should redesign all of the old cards, but maybe they should start with a new starter deck set and maybe start making Unlimited V.2 boosters with the redesign on them.
Also I think they should put this up on Kickstarter to help get funding to start the redesign project if needed.
So back on topic, I think we need to get petition going for the redesigns to become reality. Does the creator of the game ever read these boards?(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8490%2F8196863305_70caa57e65_b.jpg&hash=ea8e05f9bd62f880074e3c960f2b8aa99bb4604f)
So back on topic, I think we need to get petition going for the redesigns to become reality. Does the creator of the game ever read these boards?(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Ffarm9.staticflickr.com%2F8490%2F8196863305_70caa57e65_b.jpg&hash=ea8e05f9bd62f880074e3c960f2b8aa99bb4604f)
I read on here that Cactus is planning on putting out the next starter decks by next spring.
I don't think it would cost any extra money to redesign the template, but I would be very interested in raising money so that Cactus can hire some artists like the good ol days.
To those who do not understand why you would initiate a battle challenge, let me introduce you to a good friend of mine.
(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.cactusgamedesign.com%2FREG%2FLinkedDocuments%2FGabriel%2520%28Wa%29.gif&hash=be5b92635885b6f6afe80dc0d5d85425c7b23ee4)
Constantly Battle Challenging with this guy can easily force the opponent to burn Christian Martyr.
That is a rule I did not know... That definitely gives them a purpose. Gabriel and Amasai could really do damage...
Just revisited the original post of this thread...the cards still look absolutely amazing. Giving a redux to every single card from TexP was a huge feat to accomplish, and they all turned out spectacular. I really hope Cactus is giving this thread some heavy consideration.
I like the design, but it looks alot like MtG to me.I honestly think it looks NOTHING like MTG.
Would we still be able to use the current varsion of cards? If not, that would be a deal breaker for quite a sum of people.
In my opinion, this newer version does make Redemption look like a lot of other tcg's. I don't have serious issues with the current cards.
Daniel, may I ask why you -1'd my last post, when you said you liked this design earlier in the thread? I'm curious why you disliked this version.Woah, first of all, it was nothing personal. Second of all, I had suggested earlier that you decrease the border sizes and you ignored my advice...I simply didn't like the latest version because of large borders. I still love your suggestion to only move the special ability into the verse box. Must you make a post about it? If you have a problem with me, would you mind PM'ing me first?
Daniel, may I ask why you -1'd my last post, when you said you liked this design earlier in the thread? I'm curious why you disliked this version.Woah, first of all, it was nothing personal. Second of all, I had suggested earlier that you decrease the border sizes and you ignored my advice...I simply didn't like the latest version because of large borders. I still love your suggestion to only move the special ability into the verse box. Must you make a post about it? If you have a problem with me, would you mind PM'ing me first?
Ooo, I'd like to see it! Sorry about that. I only thought you were ignoring my advice. No hard feelings? :)Daniel, may I ask why you -1'd my last post, when you said you liked this design earlier in the thread? I'm curious why you disliked this version.Woah, first of all, it was nothing personal. Second of all, I had suggested earlier that you decrease the border sizes and you ignored my advice...I simply didn't like the latest version because of large borders. I still love your suggestion to only move the special ability into the verse box. Must you make a post about it? If you have a problem with me, would you mind PM'ing me first?
I took no offense, I was honestly just curious. Sorry if I sounded angry in any way. :)
Also, I realized after the fact that I used an older file, and already fixed the borders before you posted. I also switched from CMYK colors to RGB in my template, so the borders wont look grey.
Ooo, I'd like to see it! Sorry about that. I only thought you were ignoring my advice. No hard feelings? :)Daniel, may I ask why you -1'd my last post, when you said you liked this design earlier in the thread? I'm curious why you disliked this version.Woah, first of all, it was nothing personal. Second of all, I had suggested earlier that you decrease the border sizes and you ignored my advice...I simply didn't like the latest version because of large borders. I still love your suggestion to only move the special ability into the verse box. Must you make a post about it? If you have a problem with me, would you mind PM'ing me first?
I took no offense, I was honestly just curious. Sorry if I sounded angry in any way. :)
Also, I realized after the fact that I used an older file, and already fixed the borders before you posted. I also switched from CMYK colors to RGB in my template, so the borders wont look grey.
I would like to see Elijah reprinted with that artwork and ability. I t would help give prophets more of a boost cause they still lack the umph they need to be greatThe Deck might as well be a prophets/angels deck. Moses and Simeon (and Captain and AutO) are prophets too. They have the utmost umph.