Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Redemption® Resources and Thinktank => New Card Ideas => Topic started by: Gabe on November 09, 2016, 08:47:15 PM

Title: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: Gabe on November 09, 2016, 08:47:15 PM: Our card is almost complete! It's time to vote on the attack and defense stats. Each person gets two votes, one for attack and one for defense. Voting will run through Monday night.

Here's what our card looks like so far!

(https://www.cactusforums.com/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2Flandofredemption.com%2Fwp-content%2Fuploads%2F2016%2F11%2FPaul_vii.png&hash=26f5b67b35624d261f3e470e460b40c585894ebf)
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: Gabe on November 09, 2016, 11:10:25 PM: Please feel free to plead the case for your choice(s) below!
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: kariusvega on November 09, 2016, 11:17:25 PM: i put 12/1 cause he weakened himself to find strength
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: browarod on November 10, 2016, 03:09:32 AM: Here are my thoughts:
-His ability is incredibly powerful (makes most artifacts null (except covs/curses and CBN ones, of course) and stops an entire heretic defense just by sitting in territory) so I feel he should be stat'd so as to be susceptible to decrease as an additional possibility to counter him. Therefore I think his toughness should be at most 6, i.e.: so one Gates of Samaria decrease would discard him.
-He was a strong arbiter of the faith so I feel his strength should be high to reflect that.
-By banding him into battle you already get to draw 2, having high strength AND toughness would end up being too much of a bonus, imo, in addition to that plus his ongoing effects. But he needs to have legitimate numbers to be viable as a solo attacking Hero.

7/7 is a fun stat line to use for Heroes because 7 is a holy number, unfortunately it doesn't fit my requirements above. However, we can easily adjust the strength up and the toughness down from there to meet the various restrictions. As such I ended up with either 8/6 or 10/4 (12/2 seemed a little too lopsided, even for a Hero). In the end I settled on 10/4 as I feel the higher strength is better (and for the potential radio humor :P). I could also see 10/6, though.
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: Red Dragon Thorn on November 10, 2016, 04:26:29 AM: I voted 1/1 because if we're going to go Holy OP Batman we might as well do it right
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: ag4hosea on November 10, 2016, 07:55:00 AM: It seems that normally you'd want to add Paul to battle via a band ability, so I'm not sure whether to vote high or low, seeing as he would be very useful in a numbers battle (high band + card advantage), but keeping numbers low to play dem enhancements would also be good. Maybe a mid range, like the good old 7/5 stat that was very popular in the prophets set lol.
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: dermo4christ on November 10, 2016, 09:53:55 AM: I vote 10/4. 10, I feel is sufficient since I think he is a "Perfect 10" Hero. I think, aside from Peter, he was another "rock" of our Saviour. 4 defense is sufficient as it doesn't grant him immediate initiative like /1 would. So he still has a chance to be harmed with the /4 defense.
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: The Guardian on November 10, 2016, 11:32:27 AM: Keeping in my all the ways Paul was harmed during his life, I think his toughness should equal his strength. I like keeping the original 10/10 stats.
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: kariusvega on November 10, 2016, 12:49:17 PM: I mean I voted for 1 defense for the same reason the creator of Confusion did ;)

Obviously anyone who just wants to keep playing judges pale green will disagree :p by the way..

I was the only person not playing a judge in top cut this year

And somehow managed 3rd without confusion????

The tc aspect of his ability concerns me because it kills crowds and hsr which are the ways to not get constantly confusioned with, yes, anything above 3 strength/2 toughness..

I mean Browa we all know how formidable the heretics defense is which I played to nationals and literally never protected a soul with successfully via Philetus..

If anything he should only protect all souls in battle but hey that's why I voted those low abilities so he can have a starving chance at a rescue
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: Master Q on November 12, 2016, 12:55:21 PM: Quote from: kariusvega on November 10, 2016, 12:49:17 PM

The tc aspect of his ability concerns me because it kills crowds and hsr which are the ways to not get constantly confusioned with, yes, anything above 3 strength/2 toughness..

I mean Browa we all know how formidable the heretics defense is which I played to nationals and literally never protected a soul with successfully via Philetus..

If anything he should only protect all souls in battle but hey that's why I voted those low abilities so he can have a starving chance at a rescue

I would suggest if we wanted to keep him T.C., we should make him CBN while in battle. That way Moses negates him (he would be absurdly strong in a Moses deck), CoM and CwD negate him, and (tying in with his Thorn in the Flesh), Thorns & Thistles negates him. Throwing another suggestion out there, what if it was something like:

"Negate Idols and Sites. If you attack, protect 1 Lost Soul from opponents. If banded into battle, you may draw 2. Cannot be negated while in battle."

There's almost no reason he should negate all Artifacts, especially ones like Paul's Books & Parchments and Handkerchiefs. The one he should negate is HHI, which this does. He was a missionary, so negating Sites seems natural. I could see it also negating LS, but it isn't essential in my mind.

Protecting 1 Lost Soul, only while you attack, still means they can use DoU during a side battle on their turn, or during battle to shuffle the rest of the souls, but will nearly always ensure a rescue against a tapped liner, or whatever specific soul you want to rescue.

Or, as I've stated before, just removing the T.C. I know we're past all that now, but I want my thoughts heard. Makes me feel better. :)

By the by, I voted for 10/10 stats. I don't want to have to play Enh on him to win a battle.
Title: Re: Paul Stats Vote - Player Created Card Part VIII
Post by: kariusvega on November 12, 2016, 02:45:24 PM: Quote from: Master Q on November 12, 2016, 12:55:21 PM
Quote from: kariusvega on November 10, 2016, 12:49:17 PM

The tc aspect of his ability concerns me because it kills crowds and hsr which are the ways to not get constantly confusioned with, yes, anything above 3 strength/2 toughness..

I mean Browa we all know how formidable the heretics defense is which I played to nationals and literally never protected a soul with successfully via Philetus..

If anything he should only protect all souls in battle but hey that's why I voted those low abilities so he can have a starving chance at a rescue

I would suggest if we wanted to keep him T.C., we should make him CBN while in battle. That way Moses negates him (he would be absurdly strong in a Moses deck), CoM and CwD negate him, and (tying in with his Thorn in the Flesh), Thorns & Thistles negates him. Throwing another suggestion out there, what if it was something like:

"Negate Idols and Sites. If you attack, protect 1 Lost Soul from opponents. If banded into battle, you may draw 2. Cannot be negated while in battle."

There's almost no reason he should negate all Artifacts, especially ones like Paul's Books & Parchments and Handkerchiefs. The one he should negate is HHI, which this does. He was a missionary, so negating Sites seems natural. I could see it also negating LS, but it isn't essential in my mind.

couldn't agree more +1 +1

i do really like the looks of this revision on his ability as it is more useful and less counter intuitive. i also still really like Guardians ability..

another aspect of Paul's ability i was hesitant to mention is his synergy using Ram's Horn/Holy of Holies/Golden Cherubim.. if this is the direction we want to go i can see him being in a lot of decks but it is a pretty huge power swing in a lot of directions with his current wording