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Maybe some of our creative cardmakers could create cards for the following special abilities:

1. "Swap hands with an opponent.  Restrict players from playing dominants for remainder of game.  Cannot be negated."

2. "Return all characters removed from game to owners' territory."


Those should spice up the gameplay a bit.   

That might actually pull me back into the game... 

Carry On,

-C_S

I see what you did there.   

But this SA would probably guarantee I would get back in the game:

"Search deck for all prophets and add to territory.  Repeal ALL erratas on A New Beginning.  Cannot be negated, restricted, or ignored."

 

Maybe some of our creative cardmakers could create cards for the following special abilities:

1. "Swap hands with an opponent.  Restrict players from playing dominants for remainder of game.  Cannot be negated."

2. "Return all characters removed from game to owners' territory."


Those should spice up the gameplay a bit.   

#1 Sounds better than it would actually play, both players would be disappointed to receive a hand they can't do anything with. As for the dominant restriction, some will already have been played by the time you can use this, so it doesn't really matter all that much.

#2 Should never and hopefully will never exists.

Quote from: Smokey on July 29, 2011, 02:26:00 PM

#1 Sounds better than it would actually play, both players would be disappointed to receive a hand they can't do anything with. As for the dominant restriction, some will already have been played by the time you can use this, so it doesn't really matter all that much.

If you consider all the permutations it would actually play better than it sounds.   

I did, I hold to my opinion.

Quote from: STAMP on July 29, 2011, 02:05:09 PM

2. "Return all characters removed from game to owners' territory."

#2 Should never and hopefully will never exists.

Why not?

1. "Swap hands with an opponent.  Restrict players from playing dominants for remainder of game.  Cannot be negated."

Depending on what card type this is, empty as much of your hand as you can (storehouse would be handy), then at the next chance play this card (if its an enhancement it might be difficult, but it can be done)  You may not get much of anything useful, but you'll drop down you opponents options.

Quote from: YourMathTeacher on July 29, 2011, 04:50:25 PM

There should always be a way to permanently stop part of your opponent's strategy (assuming you can pull it off).

There is.  It's called get to five redeemed souls first.   

That's not permanently stopping part of their strategy. It's stopping all of it. 

Unfortunately, too many players these days are using combo/special decks that have no intention of reaching five LSs to win.

 

Do you honestly have an issue with people not trying to win? That's weird that people don't try to win.

Quote from: Alex_Olijar on July 29, 2011, 05:37:41 PM

Do you honestly have an issue with people not trying to win? That's weird that people don't try to win.

They try to time out win. Get one lost soul and keep you from getting any. That kind of thing. Defense heavy decks that are meant to stop you without concern for rescuing all 5 lost souls.

Time outs don't win tournaments. I'm living proof.

Quote from: STAMP on July 29, 2011, 05:19:46 PM

Isn't that the case for any ability?  Return from discard defeats the purpose of discard.  Falling Away defeats the purpose of redeeming a soul.  Returning captured characters defeats the purpose of capturing characters.

I have a Discard Phase on my own turn, so there are many purposes for discarding. I think we all see discard as a temporary solution at this point. I still think "Remove from game" should be the permanent option.

GoYS was specifically created to stop the only card that does what FA does, so this is a poor example.

As far as captured characters, Raider's Camp says otherwise.

You're missing the point.  At one time discard was seen as a permanent option until someone thought to reverse that ability.  At one time a redeemed soul was permanent until someone thought to reverse that action.  In the future, we may look back and say we all thought remove from play was a permanent option until someone thought to reverse the ability.   

...in Florida...

They might in [sic] Florida.

Agreed.  Floridians are sometimes too distracted by the simple process of voting.   

You're missing the point.

I know your point, but I still contend that there needs to be something that is permanent. Discard was permanent, until cards were made to bring them back. I would gather that's what caused "remove from the game" to be created in the first place. If "remove from the game" gets reversible, then we would need to create a new way to make permanent effects. Ripping cards is pretty permanent, so I guess that's the next step:

If a Babylonian is in play, rip your opponent's hero card in half.
You may rip apart any Lost Soul in play.
If used by an Egyptian, tear the top card of your opponent's deck into thirds.

Floridians are sometimes too distracted by the simple process of voting.   

Be careful. If I hurt you, then I will ask for my trial to be held in Florida.

Quote from: STAMP on July 29, 2011, 06:22:16 PM

You're missing the point.

 Ripping cards is pretty permanent, so I guess that's the next step

No it's not. There's a wonderful invention called tape 

Taped cards aren't tournament legal.

I know. But if ripping ever gets to that point, well, I don't have enough cards to check in that many decks, or enough money to buy all sorts of new cards. Can you imagine paying top dollar for, say, a KoT, only to have it ripped up in it's first game? If a rule is ever made that any card can be ripped, half the people will leave the game. The other half will leave when their deck gets literally decimated.

Quote from: Arch Angel on July 29, 2011, 08:32:30 PM

Taped cards aren't tournament legal.

I know. But if ripping ever gets to that point, well, I don't have enough cards to check in that many decks, or enough money to buy all sorts of new cards. Can you imagine paying top dollar for, say, a KoT, only to have it ripped up in it's first game? If a rule is ever made that any card can be ripped, half the people will leave the game. The other half will leave when their deck gets literally decimated.

Only five cards would be ripped then bud. Assuming 50 card deck.

If it were a 50 card deck, it would become an illegal deck for next round after the first tear. But yes, I know, that's why I said "literally decimated".  The problem is, what happens at a tournament, where you have to play five, six games in a row? After the first couple games, you're deck will become illegal - for the same reason you need a 51 card deck if you're going to play with Plot.

What if returning from RFG was part of a strategy?

Taped cards aren't tournament legal.

Say that to my Judas Iscariot in my 4th place T1 2p deck at Nationals 2008. 

Kirk

Well, Cannot Be Negated is permanent, so I say we can make removal from the game un-permanent.    There only has to be one permanent, non-reversible ability.  I vote CBN.

Quote from: Arch Angel on July 29, 2011, 08:32:30 PM

Taped cards aren't tournament legal.

I know. But if ripping ever gets to that point, well, I don't have enough cards to check in that many decks, or enough money to buy all sorts of new cards.

If we have to go that far, then I'll let you in on my stock of counterfeits...  but ONLY if we actually get to that point.

Carry On,

-C_S

Finally, a use for Unlimited cards other than bookmarks!

Imagine the horror on the faces of the 12 people who were handed ballots with perforated chads that read, "Is Casey guilty or not guilty?"   

Well, that explains that.

I still contend that there needs to be something that is permanent. Discard was permanent, until cards were made to bring them back. I would gather that's what caused "remove from the game" to be created in the first place. If "remove from the game" gets reversible, then we would need to create a new way to make permanent effects.

  The game needs something that takes cards out permanently, and I don't want to make everyone rip cards.  Neither do I want to do away with a special ability that does this ("remove") just to create a new special ability that does the same thing.  I would expect that "remove" will therefore always be permanent.