Cactus Game Design Message Boards
Redemption® Collectible Trading Card Game HQ => Redemption® Resources and Thinktank => Game Play Variations => Topic started by: onethfour on November 05, 2013, 07:52:49 AM
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So I know this isn't a new idea (hence the subject).
But what about adding "cost" to each card, like cards not to be allowed to be played willy-nilly.
Deck size >= 60
4 of each card allowed
Cost of card = converted cost --> strength + defense, if no strength/weakness then it costs 10
(cannot play card without tapping (turning) a lost soul you control, 1 lost soul gives 2 cost points upon tapping)
Infinite Lost Souls allowed, but at least 8 in a deck.
Lost souls untap before draw phase, and only 1 may be placed on your turn during non-battle phase.
To Win: Any ideas?
Rescuing lost souls is cool because it takes away cost points from your opponent, so it could be still rescue 5 or 6 lost souls. But I think i'd need to play it a little to try it out.
If anyone wants to try this variation with me, email me relipse at gmail dot com
I know, I know, as far as "keeping Christian theology" this doesn't really help.
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you may have something here but to win, to keep up with the game's name-sake "redemption" I suggest keeping the 5 soul win. lately I've been getting the urge to play mtg but this could fit as a very nice alternative.
when you say "4 of each card allowed" what exactly do you mean?
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I am new to redemption, so as I understand it you can only have 1 of each card that has a unique name and text, mtg lets you have 4 of each card, except a few cards like dem..tutor
My point is, you can have up to 1-4 peters, there is no limitation.
Do you have RTS? (and I know what you mean MTG in my opinion is a brilliant game, extremely strategic and fun)
Email me, and we can play. relipse at gmail
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Just for reference, there is a version of the game (Type 2) where you can have 4 of any card, with some limitations (Souls, Sites, Fortresses, Artifacts/Curses/Covenants all have different limits, cards with 2 brigades are limited to 2, and cards with more than 2 brigades are limited to 1 still). The deck size has to be at least 100, though, and it must have an equal number good and evil cards.
Part of the issue with being able to have multiples at small deck sizes is that, unlike other card games, there is no cost to playing a card. With those games, having 4 copies of the super-awesome-game-winner is fine, because you won't be able to play them right away (normally), and you need to build up to them. In 50-card Type 1 Redemption, I can stock up on all the best cards, which generally means that offenses will be stopped almost never. Games go even faster, and it's even more about who gets the best first draw.
So, if you want to play with multiples like that, I'd suggest looking into Type 2 :)
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lol bad dayne no more victims for you ;D ;D ;D
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Sorry for bringing up this one after such a long time. But how did it work out? I also asked this question myself since I liked playing MtG years ago and the idea of needing some kind of ressources to get things activated is one of the elements to create the necessary challenge and excitement!
But I wonder how only a few of lost souls can pay these cascades of enhancements etc. that are possible in normal play?
Maybe the resource concept can be worked somehow into the game using a new type or whatsovever?
What do you think?
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How about instead of a Mana system, use a turn system?
Say a card has a turn value of 5, you can't play that card until turn 5 or later. There's no limit to how many cards you can play per turn, just when you're allowed to play them.
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Need not be a Mana system but some kind of ressources to spend (the idea with the lost souls already sounds good).
The turn based approach sounds to restrictive for me. Imagine you'd only draw cards in the beginning that can be used only after some higher number of turns.
With the ressource system you can play the cards as soons as you can afford them and you might introduce cards which also spends ressources as one of their abilities as well as allowing you for searching and instantly playing additional ressources.
One could also restrict to play only one ressource per turn as a basic rule but need not necessarily to be the case.
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If you restrict down to one per turn it would be lambo's idea but worse. Also, wouldn't this make speed decks worse? Stack deck with lost souls, and just enough cards to win 5 and let the auto speed from the lost souls do the rest?
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If you restrict down to one per turn it would be lambo's idea but worse.
Not necessarily since as said there can be cards which spend additional ressources as their abilities (let's say you can play such a card spending 3 ressources for one turn and the card itself costs only 1 ressource you'd be able to play another card which costs 3 ressources even in you first turn - so this would be different from a turn based mechanism).
Also, wouldn't this make speed decks worse?
Also not necessarily since with cards described above you can gain speed (this is why MTG also has speed decks).
Stack deck with lost souls, and just enough cards to win 5 and let the auto speed from the lost souls do the rest?
What do you mean by this one? The original rules or sth. else?
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The idea is to stop powerful cards for free correct? Lost souls are auto played upon draw (redemption rule) so all you have to do is put a ton of lost souls in a deck, let the game rule itself draw your deck for you, put in a hand full of very powerful cards and outplay anyone who doesn't do the same due to simply having the most resources.
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The idea is to stop powerful cards for free correct? Lost souls are auto played upon draw (redemption rule) so all you have to do is put a ton of lost souls in a deck, let the game rule itself draw your deck for you, put in a hand full of very powerful cards and outplay anyone who doesn't do the same due to simply having the most resources.
That's why the autoplay rule needs either to be adjusted if you think about such a kind of type of play or another resource or similar system needs to be identified/introduced in order to restrict playing tons of powerful cards for free. Did not get into that deeper to be honest.
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The other reason for having resources is because they reduce the viability of "super friends" decks, where everyone just picks the best characters and mooshes them all together. The problem with the proposals above (Lost Souls == manna and turn-based) is that they add little in this regard.
Anyways, here is a resource idea I have been playing around with...
- Each character card has an assigned cost of 0, 1, or 2.
- When you put that character in play you must pay that cost.
- The first character of a brigade has an added cost of 2.
- The second character of a brigade has an added cost of 1.
- Third and subsequent characters of a brigade are free of additional costs.
- When blocking on defense from hand, the total cost is reduced by 1.
You pay the cost with card(s) from the top of your deck. So if you to pay a total cost of two you reveal the top two cards from your deck. Any lost souls go into play, any other cards are discarded.
Example: I pay 4 (2 for AUtO + 2 first sliver character) to put Angel Under the Oak in play. I make a rescue attempt and search/play Samuel paying 5 ( 1 for Samuel + 2 for first gold + 2 for first green), and I search/play King Saul paying 2 (0 for King Saul + 2 for first purple). After paying with 11 cards from my deck I now get to draw two cards, and possibly band in a hero to Samuel.
In addition to adding a cost per character that will vary based on the character's overall strength, it pushes people away from the super friends style of deck building. Best of all this type of resource mechanic will serve to limit the warping effects of dominants. After all, why should I spend slots on dominants that are going to get thrown away most of the time?
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You pay the cost with card(s) from the top of your deck. So if you to pay a total cost of two you reveal the top two cards from your deck. Any lost souls go into play, any other cards are discarded.
That system is way too harsh in my opinion. In the example you gave, you throw away a fifth of your deck in a single play.
My system would work fine for stopping "super friends" type decks by giving them all a high turn value. That means they'd just sit there being dead cards while your opponent walks in for free souls.
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You pay the cost with card(s) from the top of your deck. So if you to pay a total cost of two you reveal the top two cards from your deck. Any lost souls go into play, any other cards are discarded.
That system is way too harsh in my opinion. In the example you gave, you throw away a fifth of your deck in a single play.
Two things:
1) I picked a particularly harsh example, because AuTO/Samuel/King Saul is the absolute worst case of super friends abuse. The only reason for searching/playing King Saul is to draw two cards, and even given that players still regularly give up a deck slot for him. That fact that this example is considered a standard play speaks to just how much the current meta is broken. A resource system, should (not so subtly) nudge players away not only from playing the "strongest" characters, but additionally push them away from a mix-and-match deck building strategy.
2) It is only one fifth of your deck if fifty card decks remains the standard. As this system helps minimize the distortion due to dominants, the main reason for minimal deck sizes also evaporates.
My system would work fine for stopping "super friends" type decks by giving them all a high turn value. That means they'd just sit there being dead cards while your opponent walks in for free souls.
As your system targets individual cards it does nothing directly against the "super friends" deck. AUtO + Samuel + King Saul gets delayed until turn five (or whatever), but then goes off in all its broken glory. Your system would be akin to MtG eliminating manna color.
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Would Auto + Samuel + King Saul really have all that much "Broken glory" on turn 5 though? Currently, that combo is so nasty because it can happen on turn 1, and your opponent wont have anything set up to deal with it.
Push that combo back four turns, and the other player will have at least 12 more cards at their disposal.
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Great responses!
But my favorite still is to either have LSs as Ressources (with appropriate rule adjustments) or to have additional ressource cards (maybe even with appropriate colors for each brigade to have common and special ressources usable for payments similar to MtG).