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I would definitely run Grapes over Mayhem and I think running Humble/Prosperity/Covet just makes every deck strictly better than with NT souls. Also, Mourn & Weep seems kind of underwhelming compared to something like Anthropophobia or Nebby's Pride.
Given a lot of my main attacks are CBN and the defense isn't straight chumps
Quote from: Master Q on December 05, 2018, 10:41:23 PMGiven a lot of my main attacks are CBN and the defense isn't straight chumpsYour defense is fairly chumpy though. 2 drawing EEs, Mourn/Weep, Great Image, Bel's Banquet.Drawn Sword, Seized By Babylon, IT, and Scattered are your only non-chumpy EEs, and DS will probably get played on offense close to half the time. And all but Scattered are going to get negated in battle if you don't run Nerg.I think Anthro is an upgrade over Invoking Terror in Reserve, since IT can't be grabbed by wages and is only spammable on 2 of your characters. Based on running Zeke/Babs Teams decks at OH States this year, I can confirm that Anthro is legit for the flexibility of Negate + Battlewinner, especially with Nerg.Since I've mentioned him twice, I really think Nerg needs squeezed in here. If you are going to take the risk of Charms + two magicians, I think the threat of Nerg in the deck is so much more powerful. Your opponent will often have to decide between playing AotL on the Charms holder in territory or saving it for Nerg. (Or they make the decision with incomplete info and you punish them later for it.) Plus SBB and SH are both simply awesome on Nerg. Do you think that either IaC or AotW could be removed to make room?
Do you think that either IaC or AotW could be removed to make room?
IaC and AotW are both strictly better than every non-wages defensive card in ANY deck.
(I count The Great Fish as EC 9, but it's obviously flexible)
I would have thought that New Covenant would be nearly autoinclude in a Zeke deck. I suppose that space is a bit tight and that convert is generally less good than other types of battlewinners, but I might swap His Name for it (and then probably swap Righteous Judge to Reserve to keep more stars over there). I also might try to squeeze Micah in. He miiiiight be better than Zech here, although you can make arguments either way.
Quote from: Master Q on December 06, 2018, 11:29:25 AM(I count The Great Fish as EC 9, but it's obviously flexible)Great Fish is awesome for sure, but so is Bab Merchants, and their Unity clause is not as forgiving as Bab Siege Army's
Quote from: Red on December 06, 2018, 11:27:43 AMIaC and AotW are both strictly better than every non-wages defensive card in ANY deck.Except Angel Party Cards that can be described this way need to not be available in the card pool (except for Legacy formats). T1 is so boring, seeing "different decks" that still are 30% exactly the same. IaC, SoG, 3Woes, TSC, AotL, Humble, YWR, CM, etc.
I fundamentally disagree, I like my Redemption when both decks happen to fire off. Cards that reduce luck make that 70% difference more fun than an 85% or 90% difference but both decks horrendously misfire 10% of the time.
Ideally, the Redemption meta would have 3-4 decks that no one knows which is the best deck, AND those 3-4 decks would have a lot less overlap than decks currently do now. Including maybe a deck that maybe doesn't play SoG (but which also isn't a turtley troll deck). Or maybe that doesn't play Doms at all. Or that maybe has all no-SA LS. Something to break up the monotony of seeing SoG/TSC/AotL account for 3-6 of the 5-9 rescues a T1 game has.
One trick that a I enjoyed in my play test decks that ran Wages was to play Carcasses in the Reserve for its CBN battle winning utility against so many of the meta Heroes. Your deck is really tight already so maybe it doesn’t fit but it’s worth consideration.
Have you gotten a chance to test this deck at all? I'm building a similar defense and I'm interested in your thoughts on the new crimson stuff.
I made a couple of adjustments and played a few test games. In all the games I've played I think the only card I never used was Uzzah as there was never an opportunity. In that vein, I might end up taking out I am Creator for Captured Ark, Golden Censer, or even HSR if I'm feeling particularly heinous.PS - I hate how this deck plays.
PS - I hate how this deck plays.
Just wondering why "Moses , Friend of God" is in this deck??I don't see any exodus enhancements or other exodus humans to band to?? Is it just for the 10/10 numbers and maybe he can be banded into battle by Faith of Samuel???
Quote from: redemption collector 777 on January 03, 2019, 01:13:09 PMJust wondering why "Moses , Friend of God" is in this deck??I don't see any exodus enhancements or other exodus humans to band to?? Is it just for the 10/10 numbers and maybe he can be banded into battle by Faith of Samuel???Angel of the Winds will also exchange with him and negate ECs.Probably more reasons though...
Quote from: goalieking87 on January 03, 2019, 04:08:23 PMQuote from: redemption collector 777 on January 03, 2019, 01:13:09 PMJust wondering why "Moses , Friend of God" is in this deck??I don't see any exodus enhancements or other exodus humans to band to?? Is it just for the 10/10 numbers and maybe he can be banded into battle by Faith of Samuel???Angel of the Winds will also exchange with him and negate ECs.Probably more reasons though...Mulligans are good.
Quote from: Master Q on January 01, 2019, 12:47:53 PMPS - I hate how this deck plays.I'm curious what you mean here.
Quote from: Josh on January 03, 2019, 09:35:55 AMQuote from: Master Q on January 01, 2019, 12:47:53 PMPS - I hate how this deck plays.I'm curious what you mean here. Any deck that punishes the opponent for simply playing the game is not much fun to play or play against, imo. This deck is capable of having a combination of Jonah, habbakuk, merchants, and Babel out early enough to be more than a nuisance, and consistently enough to be more than egregious. Not to mention almost every attack this deck should be making is CBN (Zeke, Isaiah), meaning lots of boring, non-interactive battles. Not to mention the "discard an evil card from a reserve" star abilities, which trigger nearly every game (sometimes more with Isaiah) and uncounterably shoot the opponent's reserve in the foot.Long story short, this deck has so many things for free while countering almost everything the opponent does, also for free. It's not as bad as other decks of recent nats (you know the ones), but it's leaving a bad taste in my mouth just the same. I can only imagine what mirror matches would be like...
The best way to beat a good player is take away their ability to play well by giving them as few decisions as possible. Punish and uninteractivity will always be present in the best decks.
Quote from: Kevinthedude on January 03, 2019, 11:36:06 PMThe best way to beat a good player is take away their ability to play well by giving them as few decisions as possible. Punish and uninteractivity will always be present in the best decks.I agree. But not everyone is a "good player". We want people to play, right? If so, why do the winning decks of the past recent years all focus on doing the opposite?I get that from a competitive standpoint that's exactly what you want to do. I'm merely questioning if decks like this and years prior are healthy or not.Understand, this is far from as problematic as Abom, Col, and Throne blitz. But it has a bit of that blood in it. And that's not really my playstyle.Good decks don't always equal fun decks.
If only Cloud Moses didn't negate your own dudes.....
Quote from: Red Dragon Thorn on January 04, 2019, 12:39:47 PMIf only Cloud Moses didn't negate your own dudes.....Then he'd be OP.
Quote from: Gabe on January 04, 2019, 03:56:27 PMQuote from: Red Dragon Thorn on January 04, 2019, 12:39:47 PMIf only Cloud Moses didn't negate your own dudes.....Then he'd be OP. Sounds like you guys have some more play testing to do before releasing whatever character you are hinting at.