Author Topic: New card Jackals question.  (Read 401 times)

Offline redemption collector 777

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New card Jackals question.
« on: October 12, 2018, 10:46:44 PM »
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Jackals SA: You may banish a card ( or 2 characters from a discard pile) If Jackals is discarded , discard a Hero. May band to Jackals. Can not be prevented.

Just wanted to double check on the special ability on the Jackals card.


1. If I decided to block a lone hero (5/5) with one Jackals card ( 2/1) and then decide not to play any enhancements and let Jackals get discarded by numbers , does the lone hero have SI to interrupt or negate the Jackals discard ability???

Offline Watchman

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #1 on: October 13, 2018, 08:21:12 AM »
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If the target hero is the one in battle, then I would say yes based upon the below (unless there’s something I’m missing).

The battle is not yet over just because the defender chooses to allow his blocker to die by the numbers. Although the defender cannot play dominants at this point, if a triggered ability activates as a result of the blocked being discarded, and that ability targets the sole rescuing hero for removal, then the attacker has a chance to respond with a negate or interrupt enhancement.

These are the relevant portions of Battle Resoultion and SI in the REG:

Battle Resolution
2. Determine the outcome of the battle. Discard all characters that are being discarded based
on the strength and toughness comparison. Discard all Enhancements that no longer have
a character that can use them in battle.
3. Activate all effects that trigger based on the result of the battle.

SI
When a player is controlling character(s) in battle and a completing effect of an opponent’s ability, or a game rule that has been triggered by an effect of an opponent’s ability, would leave that player with no character in battle when the effect has completed, they have Special Initiative...If the card with the removing effect was already removed from play due to one of its effects, it may still be targeted during Special Initiative by an Enhancement that specifically targets its card type.
« Last Edit: October 13, 2018, 09:34:16 AM by Watchman »
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Offline uthminister [BR]

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #2 on: October 13, 2018, 09:36:06 AM »
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Jackals SA: You may banish a card ( or 2 characters from a discard pile) If Jackals is discarded , discard a Hero. May band to Jackals. Can not be prevented.

Just wanted to double check on the special ability on the Jackals card.


1. If I decided to block a lone hero (5/5) with one Jackals card ( 2/1) and then decide not to play any enhancements and let Jackals get discarded by numbers , does the lone hero have SI to interrupt or negate the Jackals discard ability???

Watchman is right about the Battle Resolution part but I believe once you enter battle resolution the Battle itself is already over. Jackals is equivalent to playing Christian Martyr in Battle Resolution which isn't really allowed based on the rulebook. I believe the battle would resolve with Jackals being discarded and a Soul being surrendered but the chosen Hero would then be discarded after Jackals discard is triggered by being discarded.

Offline Watchman

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #3 on: October 13, 2018, 09:40:49 AM »
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+1 That makes the most sense.
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Offline Gabe

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #4 on: October 13, 2018, 09:47:15 AM »
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I'd like to offer a slightly different perspective. I agree with Travis that there is no SI or playing of Enhancements during battle resolution. And I agree with Watchman that Jackals triggers in step 3 of battle resolution (quoted above). His quote from battle resolution stopped there. I think we need to see step 4 as well.

Quote
4. If the battle was ever a rescue attempt and it has not already been successful, determine the result of the rescue attempt. If the battle was never a rescue attempt and only a battle challenge, determine the result of the battle challenge. Determine the result of the block. If the rescue attempt is successful, the defender surrenders a Lost Soul.

This is the part where success or failure is determined and a Lost Soul is awarded. If the Hero is no longer in battle, I don't think it's successful or that a Lost Soul is awarded.

If that assessment is correct, I doubt that is how we want Jackals to work. We will discuss this as an elder team and adjust it accordingly.
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Offline Watchman

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #5 on: October 21, 2018, 02:43:27 PM »
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If that assessment is correct, I doubt that is how we want Jackals to work. We will discuss this as an elder team and adjust it accordingly.

Has there been any discussion amongst the elders about this yet? I’ve been playtesting Jackals so I’d like to know what the definitive answer is.

Thanks.
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Offline RedemptionAggie

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #6 on: October 21, 2018, 05:33:58 PM »
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I'm pretty sure we're updating Jackals to "discard a Hero in a territory".


Offline Watchman

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #7 on: October 21, 2018, 06:39:23 PM »
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Definitely cleaner. Thanks
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Offline redemption collector 777

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Re: New card Jackals question.
« Reply #8 on: October 22, 2018, 01:13:38 AM »
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I'm pretty sure we're updating Jackals to "discard a Hero in a territory".

Agreed. This is a good change.