Cactus Game Design Message Boards

Yes, because you are targeting the enhancement not the character

I concur.  The fortress only protects the character.

I disagree by discarding the weapon you are successfully effecting the evil character.

How? You can discard enhancements played on an immune character in battle. How is this different?

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on November 15, 2008, 01:00:08 PM

I disagree by discarding the weapon you are successfully effecting the evil character.

In what way?

It effects the characters stats. If somone is holding a weapon and you confiscate the weapon that affects the characters moral, emotions and status in life, similarily if I discard a weapon from a charcter protected from effect it should be able to stay on the character. The Ec is holding the weapon for ralph's sake!

First of all, it's just a sword, you totally need to re-examine your life if someone takes all that away from you.

Second of all, it doesn't affect the character's stats because the numbers don't count in territory.

So what are you doing to affect the character?

Weapon count in battle though, you are talking away the weapon he is holding which lowers his number in battle were it really counts.

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on November 17, 2008, 05:22:56 PM

Quote from: The Schaef on November 16, 2008, 11:09:11 PM

First of all, it's just a sword, you totally need to re-examine your life if someone takes all that away from you.

Second of all, it doesn't affect the character's stats because the numbers don't count in territory.

So what are you doing to affect the character?

Weapon count in battle though, you are talking away the weapon he is holding which lowers his number in battle were it really counts.

But numbers on weapons add nothing to the character Ex. my nergalsherazer(7/7) can hold swift horses (2/2) and still block Widow

yes they do, not in territory but in battle they do.

no they don't

sure they do. A weapon on nergal sherazzer (2/2) makes him a 9/9 in battle. When he blocks he is a 7/7 but then the weapon is adding on, by discarding  a weapon on a protected character you are effecting his chances of winning the battle. Here is another way to think about it: Logically if nergal is protected and his weapon on him, then it should protected two. I have found out from past arguments that redemption only accepts the logic it wants to. If I am protected from the enemy my weapon is protected from the enemy.
     If it is ruled the other way ( which is the way it will be ruled) I will reject the weapon/jail analogies arguing the game of redemption works in a different manner than life itself which it does in manny aspects.

 

If it is ruled the other way ( which is the way it will be ruled) I will reject the weapon/jail analogies arguing the game of redemption works in a different manner than life itself which it does in manny aspects.

If my weapon is strong enough to BREAK (d/c) your weapon... how does that work with jail at all?

I would say yes they are because they are not the ec themselves.

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on November 17, 2008, 05:22:56 PM

Weapon count in battle though, you are talking away the weapon he is holding which lowers his number in battle were it really counts.

I would also suggest to Hobbit that insulting the integrity of the ruling structure is not the best way to win points for your argument.

I just said what it is.  If that is an insult to you then some things need to be changed.

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on November 17, 2008, 05:22:56 PM

Weapon count in battle though, you are talking away the weapon he is holding which lowers his number in battle were it really counts.

Two things:
1) You can discard Enhancements in battle separately from the character, so no, you are not lowering his numbers in battle, you are only taking away Enhancements on him.

Which in turn lowers the heroes numbers.

Quote from: TheHobbit13 on November 17, 2008, 05:22:56 PM

Weapon count in battle though, you are talking away the weapon he is holding which lowers his number in battle were it really counts.

  You can discard Enhancements played on immune characters like Nero because you are not specifically targeting Nero.  So I see no reason non-character cards in Kingdoms could not be targeted.

How many immune warrior class characters are there? Weapons you have said your self behave differently from  other enhancements so you cant treat them life normal played enhancement in battle. Why because it is attached to the character. If the character is holding the weapon why is it in the line of fire? It is because it isn't a character so it's not protected, but this is what I am saying: If the character is protected and the character is holding the enhancement logically the enhancement is protected. + it affects his/her status in battle by lowering his possible stat's from the weapon. I can see how you see it but you are lumping normal enhancements with weapon class enhancements into the same catagory.

Weapon class enhancements are diffirent from normal enhancements whether the non weapon class enhancements are discard if the character is protected from effect is irrelevent



"Yes, and I enumerated the exact ways in which they behave differently"

In which you said "characters hold weapons in territory" ( Bryon could have said that instead of you though I am not sure) if they hold the weapons in territory it is only reasonable to expect them to be protected in territory when the character is protected , after all he is holding on to the weapon. It makes perfect sense.

 Your saying that a character who is protected from effect doesn't protect his own enhancements in any other situation (first off you are comparing weapon class enhancements with regular enhancements as if they have the same traits in the situation which they do not. The character is not holding to his other enhancements so naturally they are discarded .Second EVERY other situation that invloves this controversy results in the field of battle not in territory this is the only situation that can result in territory currently, it isn't fair to say territory is equal to the field of battle.  This is if you say the hero is not holding on to the weapon in battle)

If there isn't a warrior class character who is immune to someone it matters because that means that every other in which you claim the enhancement gets discarded situation is actually a different situation.

Can I discard Wings of Calamity on a demon in KOTW even though the demon is protected? Either WIngs can be discarded or Weapons in kingdom can be it cannot be both ways.

If there isn't a warrior class character who is immune to someone it matters because that means that every other in which you claim the enhancement gets discarded situation is actually a different situation.

Abeizer (sp?) is immune to crimson AND is WC. You may move on now. I fail to see he immune characters even FIT into this conversation, unless a card is immune in territory it makes very little difference.

Hobbit not to sound mean but listen, just once.

Here's a better idea.  Next time don't say that the ruling authority (which btw is Rob only, the playtesters merely assist in brainstorming and passing down the decision) just decides to use whatever logic he/she/they feel like using.