Author Topic: A Little Shame  (Read 275 times)

Offline SignoftheStar

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A Little Shame
« on: October 10, 2018, 05:45:54 PM »
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Shame: 3/-2, Set aside up to 2 of an opponent's Heroes for 2 turns. CBI if a male and a female Hero are set aside by this ability.

Let's say I were to activate Shame on something with less than 2 toughness. Something simple, like, oh, Spirit of Fear (0/1). There are two Heroes in battle, two Heroes of the same gender, so I don't trip the CBI part.
Spirit should be discarded by game rule, as it now has a toughness of -1.

1. It's my understanding that the SA of Shame should still resolve. Even though it should fizzle and discard immediately after resolution, as the EC using it is no longer in battle, the EE was played and must therefore resolve, no less than something that discards by it's own ability, like Achan's Sin or Death of Unrighteous. Pretty positive about this one, but I thought I'd check while I was here.

My real question is
2. In this situation, since Shame fizzles, can the opponent interrupt it? The EE is no longer in play- not because of a special ability that you could interrupt, as in the case of Achan's Sin, but by game rule, because the EC that used it was discarded, also by game rule.

I don't think you can interrupt. Here's my reasoning:
When Achan's Sin interrupts the battle and discards everything in it, you have initiative to interrupt. It's mutual destruction by mutual removal- textbook initiative. The card that's discarding is still in play until the ability resolves, at which time it leaves play and can no longer be targeted by a negate.
In the case of Shame and Spirit of Fear, the difference lies in Shame discarding its user and therefore getting discarded itself because of something completely unrelated to the setting aside of the Heroes in battle. By the time you get to check for initiative, the Enhancement is already gone.
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Offline Kevinthedude

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Re: A Little Shame
« Reply #1 on: October 10, 2018, 05:52:35 PM »
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Enhancements don't increase and decrease character's stats, they just change the total strength and toughness in battle for the purposes of initiative and battle resolution. A character with 1 toughness doesn't actually die from playing an enhancement with a negative toughness value.

Offline SignoftheStar

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Re: A Little Shame
« Reply #2 on: October 10, 2018, 06:11:15 PM »
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Is that right?

Huh.
You know, that makes sense, honestly, but I guess I just never figured that the decrease didn't actually cut into their stats.

Welp, that sure answers this question, doesn't it?
Answer: Sign of the Star still has no idea what he's talking about!

Thanks Kevin!
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Online The Guardian

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Re: A Little Shame
« Reply #3 on: October 10, 2018, 06:37:43 PM »
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Is that right?

Huh.
You know, that makes sense, honestly, but I guess I just never figured that the decrease didn't actually cut into their stats.

Welp, that sure answers this question, doesn't it?
Answer: Sign of the Star still has no idea what he's talking about!

Thanks Kevin!

Don't feel too bad...when we decided to start using more negative numbers with the Fall of Man set we realized that it wasn't quite as simple as we may have initially thought. We had several long discussions on how we wanted negative numbers to impact the battle.
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Offline Kevinthedude

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Re: A Little Shame
« Reply #4 on: October 10, 2018, 06:44:12 PM »
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Is that right?

Huh.
You know, that makes sense, honestly, but I guess I just never figured that the decrease didn't actually cut into their stats.

Welp, that sure answers this question, doesn't it?
Answer: Sign of the Star still has no idea what he's talking about!

Thanks Kevin!

It's an easy mistake to make, I also thought negative toughness enhancements would kill characters when I first saw them!

Offline SignoftheStar

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Re: A Little Shame
« Reply #5 on: October 10, 2018, 07:28:24 PM »
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heh, I appreciate it, gentlemen. You give me too much credit.
The core of all life is a limitless chest of tales.